Byron Pitts Discusses Evacuation Before WTC 7 Collapse
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoasZUbmwpo
In a CBS News report from about 6:30 in the evening of 9/11, correspondent Byron Pitts describes how police apparently had advance knowledge of the collapse of WTC 7. He says: "Back live we have had little relief here. Take a look at this. About an hour ago, World Trade Center building number 7 collapsed. A 42-story building, weakened by the devastation that had occurred earlier today. No word any casualties in the building. It was the one calamity that was not a surprise. Police had evacuated the area hours ago, fearful building number 7 would indeed fall down."
Since fire had never before caused a steel-framed building to collapse, why were they so afraid WTC 7 would fall that they had the foresight to evacuate the surrounding area?
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From jod911
I already posted this today; so please pardon the repetition. But the topic here is the same as for Potential WTC7 Manslaughter Charges?
The text of the NIST report shows what the defence would bring up in court.
BTW, I got this at a site that all of us should look at, namely jod911, the 'debunking' website supposedly comparable to the Journal of 911 Studies. Articles there supposedly clear up 9-11 disinfo spread by ... us!
We will need to read the whole article carefully and find the holes in it.
It is written by Mark Roberts. The following is a quote from NIST, in that article:
• The building had sustained damage from debris falling into the building, and they were not sure about the structural stability of the building.
• The building had large fires burning on at least six floors. Any one of these six fires would have been considered a large incident during normal FDNY operations.
• There was no water immediately available for fighting the fires.
• They didn’t have equipment, hose, standpipe kits, tools, and enough handie talkies for conducting operations inside the building.
At approximately, 2:30 p.m., FDNY officers decided to completely abandon WTC 7, and the final order was given to evacuate the site around the building. The order terminated the ongoing rescue operations at WTC 6 and on the rubble pile of WTC 1. Firefighters and other emergency responders were withdrawn from the WTC 7 area, and the building continued to burn. At approximately 5:20 p.m., some three hours after WTC 7 was abandoned the building experienced a catastrophic failure and collapsed.
the disagreement seems to be
over the speed and symmetry of the collapse, and whether a steel-reinforced skyscraper can collapse in that manner because of some fire and some damage to one corner of the building. The NY Times said WTC7 was abandoned at 11:30am, but that's a minor discrepency. The point is it should not collapse at all from six floors of fires, and it certainly should not collapse in 7 seconds, symmetrically, into its own footprint. As Steven Jones has said, if the damage to the corner of the building was the source of the collapse, then why doesn't it tilt in that direction? Instead, it collapses straight down.
And of course there were the witnesses to a demolition countdown, explosions, etc.
The other details you list here are things everyone generally agrees on, except perhaps the judgement over the severity of the fires.
Thanks, simuvac, good
Thanks, simuvac, good replies. What you bring up is what we all need to focus on, and what a prosecuting attorney would need to focus on. Buildings do not fall like that outside of CD.
When you say, "The other details that you list..." I do hope you realize that you are speaking to the NIST report authors, and to Mark Robers, who penned the jod911 hitpiece. I quoted it so that all of us may know what arguments we face from so-called debunkers.
Thanks, Student, I am fairly
Thanks, Student, I am fairly familiar with the typical replies. If this weren't a forum expecting brief answers, I would write an essay in response to these people. But for now these terse shots will have to suffice.
Linking to another discussion on this topic today...
Also look here.
Since You Asked
Chris Boyle expands on what he saw when he viewed the south side, not just the corner.
Captain Chris Boyle
Engine 94 - 18 years
Boyle: ...on the north and east side of 7 it didn’t look like there was any damage at all, but then you looked on the south side of 7 there had to be a hole 20 stories tall in the building, with fire on several floors. Debris was falling down on the building and it didn’t look good.
Firehouse: When you looked at the south side, how close were you to the base of that side?
Boyle: I was standing right next to the building, probably right next to it.
Firehouse: When you had fire on the 20 floors, was it in one window or many?
Boyle: There was a huge gaping hole and it was scattered throughout there. It was a huge hole. I would say it was probably about a third of it, right in the middle of it. And so after Visconti came down and said nobody goes in 7, we said all right, we’ll head back to the command post. We lost touch with him. I never saw him again that day.
http://www.firehouse.com/terrorist/911/magazine/gz/boyle.html
Another report talks of damage that suggested collapse was a real possibility:
...Captain Varriale told Chief Coloe and myself that 7 World Trade Center was badly damaged on the south side and definitely in danger of collapse. Chief Coloe said we were going to evacuate the collapse zone around 7 World Trade Center, which we did.
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/...
Fire chief Daniel Nigro says further assessment of the damage indicated that it was severe:
The biggest decision we had to make was to clear the area and create a collapse zone around the severely damaged [WTC Building 7]. A number of fire officers and companies assessed the damage to the building. The appraisals indicated that the building's integrity was in serious doubt.
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/entity.jsp?id=1521846767-634
Another fireman reported damage that progressed as the day wore on.
Deputy Chief Peter Hayden
Division 1 - 33 years
...also we were pretty sure that 7 World Trade Center would collapse. Early on, we saw a bulge in the southwest corner between floors 10 and 13, and we had put a transit on that and we were pretty sure she was going to collapse. You actually could see there was a visible bulge, it ran up about three floors. It came down about 5 o’clock in the afternoon, but by about 2 o’clock in the afternoon we realized this thing was going to collapse.
Firehouse: Was there heavy fire in there right away?
Hayden: No, not right away, and that’s probably why it stood for so long because it took a while for that fire to develop. It was a heavy body of fire in there and then we didn’t make any attempt to fight it. That was just one of those wars we were just going to lose. We were concerned about the collapse of a 47-story building there. We were worried about additional collapse there of what was remaining standing of the towers and the Marriott, so we started pulling the people back after a couple of hours of surface removal and searches along the surface of the debris. We started to pull guys back because we were concerned for their safety.
http://www.firehouse.com/terrorist/911/magazine/gz/hayden.html
http://www.911myths.com/html/wtc7_damage.html
what about the witnesses who
what about the witnesses who reported a countdown to demolition, and witnesses who reported explosives going off inside WTC7? How does that factor into your understanding? Or how about the pool of molten metal under WTC7?
Witnesses
I am sorry, one anonymous e-mail does not count as "witnesses".
Second-hand reports of molten metal neither prove nor disprove either theory, since they are not explained by the use of explosives.
do your homework, james
I'm going to paste an excerpt from a fellow truther below. Feel free to learn something.
-Pacifica Radio interview - April 27th 2005:
Hosted by Bonnie Falkner
Guest: Indira Singh (Ground Zero Emergency Worker)
Bonnie: How long did you work as an emergency medical technician and exactly what is it that you were doing (at ground zero)?
Indira: ...when I got there we were setting up triage sites (at ground zero), close, very close to the area. The triage site that I was setting up was behind, well, to the east of Building 7 where Building 7 came down.....we were setting up triages as close to the pile as possible. so what we
were doing was setting up different kinds of stations. IV stations, cardiac stations, wound stations, burn stations ...just trying to have an organized space. What happened with that particular triage site is that pretty soon
afternoon, after mid-day on 9/11 we had to evacuate that because they told us Building 7 was coming down... I do believe that they brought Building 7 down... By noon or one o'clock they told us we had to move from that triage
site up to Pace University a little further away because Building 7 was going to come down or being brought down.
Bonnie: Did they actually use the word "brought down" and who was it that was telling you this?
Indira: The fire department... the fire department and they did use the word "we're going to have to bring it down."
Excerpt from above is heard approximately ten minutes into the interview.
Audio: http://www.gunsandbutter.net/archives.php?si=78
Show description and info about Indira Singh (scroll down to "April 27th 2005")
http://www.gunsandbutter.net/archives.php?page=10
Sep 20, 2006
Pacifica Radio's Guns & Butter
New York Stories: 9/11 First Responders
Former Air Force Speical Operations for Search and Rescue, Kevin McPadden
Audio stream:
http://www.gunsandbutter.net/archives.php?si=142
Show archive page is here:
http://www.gunsandbutter.net/archives.php?page=3
McPadden's speech begins at 46 minutes in
@ 48:14 he makes the following comment about what he witnessed while at Ground
Zero on 9/11...
"They said you know you've got to stay behind this line because they're thinking about taking this building down, they're not sure if it's stable or not, so they were holding a line off because they had knowledge that something
was gonna happen. Well, they pushed us back a little bit....a couple of minutes later they started coming down....people started coming back out to the street, I watched five New York City buses jam packed with people wanting to do search and rescue head down there towards Building 7 - people walk out into the middle of the street to see these people off, like bon voyage and right then Building 7 came down."
Related information about Building 7:
Former NYPD Officer & 9/11 First Responder Craig Bartmer:
"I was real close to Building 7 when it fell down... That didn't sound like just a building falling down to me while I was running away from it. There's a lot of eyewitness testimony down there of hearing explosions. I didn't see any
reason for that building to fall down the way it did -- and a lot of guys should be saying the same thing. I don't know what the fear is coming out and talking about it? I don't know -- but it's the truth."
[...]
"I walked around it (Building 7). I saw a hole. I didn't see a hole bad enough to knock a building down, though. Yeah there was definitely fire in the building, but I didn't hear any... I didn't hear any creaking, or... I didn't hear any indication that it was going to come down. And all of a sudden the radios exploded and everyone started screaming 'get away, get away, get away from it!'... It was at that moment... I looked up, and it was nothing I would ever imagine seeing in my life. The thing started pealing in on itself... Somebody grabbed my shoulder and I started running, and the shit's hitting the ground behind me, and the whole time you're hearing "boom, boom, boom, boom,
boom." I think I know an explosion when I hear it... Yeah it had some damage to it, but nothing like what they're saying... Nothing to account for what we saw... I am shocked at the story we've heard about it to be quite honest."
Video Interview:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-
2283625397351664218&q=Craig+Bartmer&hl=en
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-Reporter Al Jones: "People started to run away from the scene [WTC7] and I turned in time to see what looked like a skyscraper implosion -- looked like it had been done by a demolition crew -- the whole thing just collapsing down
on itself and another big huge plume of gray and white smoke shooting up into the air and then more of the smoke billowing up the street here... so that's number one, number two, and now number seven that have come down from this
explosion."
Live 9-11 Report from 1010 WINS NYC News Radio, presented in the documentary "911 Eyewitness" (Forward to 28:25)
Video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=65460757734339444&q
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-Emergency worker: "We were watching the building [WTC7] actually 'cause it was on fire. the bottom floors of the building were on fire and. we heard this sound that sounded like a clap of thunder. turned around -- we were shocked to
see that the building was ah well it looked like there was a shockwave ripping through the building and the windows all busted out. it was horrifying. about a second later the bottom floor caved out and the building followed after
that. we saw the building crash down all the way to the ground. we were in shock."
Live 9-11 Report from 1010 WINS NYC News Radio, presented in the documentary "911 Eyewitness" (Forward to 31:30)
Video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=65460757734339444&q
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-Columbia Journalism Review - May/June 2003, by Thomas Franklin
Excerpt from an article written by award winning photographer, Thomas Franklin, who snapped the world famous photo of firemen raising the American flag at ground zero. In the article Franklin explains that all of ground zero
was evacuated less than an hour before WTC 7 was demolished at approximately 5:20 pm on 9/11:
"Much of what happened to me on September 11 is a blur, but this moment I clearly remember: It was 4:45 p.m., and all the firemen and rescue workers were evacuating Ground Zero after word came that a third building -- WTC 7 --
was ready to fall. I had only a few frames left, and an entire day's worth of pictures to develop, so I prepared to head back to New Jersey."
Article: http://archives.cjr.org/year/02/2/franklin.asp
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- CBS News Anchor, Dan Rather, makes comments after Building 7 falls down:
"Amazing, incredible pick your word. For the third time today, it's reminiscent of those pictures we've all seen too much on television before, where a building was deliberately destroyed by well placed dynamite to knock it down."
Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tr6_WRPZjIM
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-WTC lease holder Larry Silverstein's comments about Building 7 in the PBS documentary, America Rebuilds (2002):
"I remember getting a call from the, er, fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull and then we watched the building collapse."
Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CahEva8zQas
In the same documentary, America Rebuilds, a clean up worker at ground zero uses the term "pull" when preparing for the controlled demolition of Building 6: (Use of the word "pull" as slang for "demolish")
Unidentified Construction Worker: "Hello? Oh, we're getting ready to pull building six."
Luis Mendes, NYC Dept of Design and Construction: "We had to be very careful how we demolished building six. We were worried about the building six coming down and then damaging the slurry walls, so we wanted that particular building
to fall within a certain area."
Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNEoiOP76QQ
Larry Silverstein Answers WTC Building 7 Charges: Says "pull it" meant to evacuate firefighters, but there were no firefighters in the building:
Article:: http://www.informationliberation.com/index.php?id=4718
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"Of course in some circles of the controlled demolition industry 'Pull' is used to mean that you actually demolish a building."
-Benjamin Chertoff, Researcher for Popular Mechanics, on Coast to Coast AM - March 5, 2005
Audio:
http://www.pumpitout.com/audio/debunking_popular_mechanics.mp3
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"This is work of man. This is a hired job. [Larry Silverstein] said it himself. You hear him saying 'Pull it' down."
-Controlled Demolition Expert Danny Jowenko
Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sep-HDZoEBM
Danny Jowenko owns a demolition firm called "Jowenko Exposieve Demolitie B.V.". Information about his company's qualifications can be found posted on their website:
Link: http://www.jowenko.com/index.php/1,3,2
He's also listed on ImplosionWorld.com's website as being one of their licensed blasters and associates":
http://www.implosionworld.com/history4.htm
Related:
Controlled Demo Expert Danny Jowenko confirms that Building 7 was brought down on purpose:
http://www.911blogger.com/node/3231
Danny Jowenko has 20 years experience performing conventional "bottom up" controlled demolitions of structures. When first interviewed about the WTC
buildings and their "collapses", Jowenko -- not being familiar with unconventional "Top Down" controlled demolition method, and not having studied information supporting WTC CD theories in depth -- stated that he did not think the twin towers were brought down by explosives. However, after examining WTC-7 information for the first time later on during the same interview, he stated that he believes building was a conventional "bottom up"
demolition, which he has experience performing.
Months after the interview (after he researched Building 7 in greater detail than he had during his original interview for a Dutch TV documentary about 9/11), Mr. Jowenko went on record again to say that he's still convinced explosives brought down Building 7. His current opinions and research about the towers are unknown at this time.
Many "skeptics" argue that Mr. Jowenko is only 1 of thousands in the demolition industry who believe WTC-7 was a CD. This is a false and disingenuous claim, because it's unknown how many people experienced in demolition (or Structural design) actually believe in the WTC controlled
demolition theory, or how many have actually studied it. Most have never gone on public record to say what they believe happened.
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Structural Experts Say:
"WTC-7 was with the greatest probability brought down by controlled demolition done by experts."
Link: http://911blogger.com/node/2925
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Video clips of World Trade Center Building 7 being "pulled" on 9/11:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tr6_WRPZjIM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWemhf8fZ2w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLnBSyc4ICo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=th17YNqOCSk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmL9F-TSIes
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ewf3zYS-QkA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzLqx_gjBAg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwjmqkjwnvQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uPfKghBIOY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFsXzKa2ce0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0scE7bQWdk
7 minute video presentation on the destruction of Building 7 on 9/11...
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-
4556787288866368337&sourceid=docidfeed&hl=undefined