11/11 Launch of Truther.org!
Abby Mon, 11/12/2007 - 3:07am
Check it out fellow truthers!!! Truther.org has officially been launched today. I hope all of you enjoy the site. Right now we are just selling Truther t-shirts but will soon be adding other clothing and merchandise (stickers, etc). A dollar from every purchase will be donated to the Feal Good Foundation (www.fealgoodfoundation.com). This is the front and back of the flier we made to promote the site. Feel free to download and distribute (files available at http://www.truther.org/action/propaganda.html)
Special thanks to Rick Pickett for his awesome designs and hard work on the site.
- Abby's blog
- Login to post comments
Excellent Website Abby and SD 911 Truthers.
This is a professional site with comprehensive CREDIBLE information.
Visiually good, with links and references to an excelent resource of books, videos, music etc
The pdf brochures are excellent, to the point, just enough to arouse serious questions in the mind of a beginner in this.
This is a very good step in raising the bar for 911 Truth.
With a list of events, donation link, artwork etc this is STATE of the ART in 911 Truth and truly inspiring.
Excellent.
The merchandising idea is a very good idea especially it will help raise funds for the 1st Responders.
I do hope that you will get the support and endorsement of some of the Hollywood 911 Truth personalities to generate publicity and help you in your fund-raising efforts for the 1st Responders.
This is a double-edge sword that is being used against the cabal that carried out 911 and is maintaining its lies.
Fundraising is important as it will definitely help the 1st Responders and expose the hypocrisy of the likes of Bush, Giuliani etc in neglecting the financial needs 1st Responders.
There is nothing wrong in merchandising especially as it is being used for such a good cause like the Feal Good Foundation. Let no one tell you otherwise.
I sincerely laud all your efforts and the standard you are setting back in the West Coast.
Great Job.
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The CONSTITUTION is NOT going to "collapse" into pulverized dust no matter how much thermate/explosives or planes they throw at it
thanks a lot :)
we worked really hard on it. it is great to get that feedback
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Great site!!!
WOW, this site is awesome!!! Congratulations to all of you who made this happen. The site is very professional and informative. Great graphics, links etc. I commend ALL of you who are involved and passionate and put yourselves OUT there. There is a lot of wonderful information to be garnered from this site. Good job, guys!!!!!!!!!
One definite exaggeration verging on falsehood
Stratesec/Securacom was never "in charge of" the WTC complex. It was a consultant on security until late 2000.
You are not entitled to "your own facts" on this. The "Dummies" approach does not authorize you to present simplifications that distort or exaggerate facts, all the more so insofar as these distortions can easily be demonstrated by the debunker squad.
The original work to reveal the Marvin Bush connection to security at the WTC, Dulles and United Airlines was a highly detailed, well-researched article by Margie Burns in 2003, archived here:
http://www.populist.com/03.02.burns.html
All stories about Marvin Bush and the WTC I have seen originate with the research by Margie Burns. Most everything that people repeat about this connection is a corrupted, exaggerated version of what Burns wrote.
Securacom/Stratesec, part-owned by Marvin Bush, was a consultant on security at the WTC complex for several years in the 1990s. Its total contracts with the Port Authority during that time amounted to $8 million (presumably a very small fraction of the total WTC security costs during that time). The business ended in 2000, when Bush also stopped being a director of the company.
The connection MAY mean that Bush or his associates had access to sensitive security information about the WTC. However, this would be all the more true of the Port Authority (which provided the actual WTC security as the owner and in the form of its own PA Police Department), the City of New York, the states of New York and New Jersey, etc. etc.
Securacom/Stratesec was a CONSULTANT. NOT in charge of security. And the relationship ended in 2000, according to the only one who's done the original research.
Because they were not in charge of security or in any way in charge of complex, but merely CONSULTANTS who ceased doing business with the Port Authority a year before Sept. 2001, Marvin Bush and/or his company did NOT
- order the bomb sniffing dogs off the site on Sept. 6th
- order a "power down" on the weekend before 9/11 (if that ever even happened).
These myths are attributable to people repeating shit without bothering to research it for themselves, and corrupting the known facts in the process. They are insulting to people who do bother to research, like Margie Burns.
Again, this doesn't mean Marvin Bush or his company did not have access to sensitive information that may or may not have been used for nefarious purposes. It merely means that MOST of what is passed around among "9/11 researchers/activists" on this topic is a corruption of the facts uncovered by Margie Burns.
Here is a great article I found from 1997 - !!! - describing the implementation of the new security systems at WTC following the 1993 attacks.
http://securitysolutions.com/mag/security_world_trade_center/
The main plan seems to have been drawn up by KROLL ASSOCIATES - very high on the spook totem poll, these are the guys who contract presidential security to the Secret Service and what not. (Also, they employed Jerome Hauer!)
EXCERPTS:
Today, before anyone can gain access to the World Trade Center's sub-grade parking garages, they must meet a host of security requirements and pass through a system of access control devices that makes extremely unlikely the recurrence of a blast such as the one that rocked the complex, killing six people and injuring 1,000. ... Would-be terrorists will find it no easier to gain access by foot. Tenants and employees have to put their photo ID/proximity cards on turnstiles to gain entrance to the four buildings in the complex - the Twin Towers and Buildings 4 and 5 - managed by the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey. All visitors must wait to be issued time- and date-sensitive visitor badges with magnetic stripes that indicate clearly which floors or buildings they are authorized to enter. (...)
Despite its size, strength and sophistication, the World Trade Center did not have an automated access control system before the blast. Most public office buildings in America do not. But that trend is likely to change, now that the "It can't happen here" mindset has been replaced with the determination that "It won't happen here again" - at least not at the World Trade Center. (...)
"After the bombing, we had the top security consultants in the nation, Kroll Associates, do a complete security analysis for us, and we followed their recommendations," says Douglas G. Karpiloff, program manager, security systems for the WTC. A 26-year veteran of the Port Authority, Karpiloff, a Certified Protection Professional, was general manager of tenant services after the bomb went off. He is responsible for the overall facility management of the $50 million security improvement program: $15 million in completed interim improvements and $35 million for permanent improvements, from the 250 multi-ton perimeter planters that prevent vehicles from crashing into the buildings, to the network of fiber optics and copper that will connect the redundant PCs and their multi-task, multi-user operating system to the lobby, parking and perimeter access control systems, alarms, intercom and CCTV systems. (...)
According to Hurley, the Port Authority and WTC are unique because they have their own police force and emergency response personnel, who serve as an in-house fire brigade. The fire brigade has pre-positioned crash carts with Scott air packs and fire fighting equipment so they can begin fire suppression activities even before the fire department arrives. (...)
The parking access control system at the WTC was manufactured and installed by Ensec Inc., Boca Raton, Fla. The Enworks EN2000 system has a redundant host configuration and supports full function work stations. It is designed to integrate vehicle and driver access control, alarm monitoring and the parking security intercom. (...)
The lobby access control system will include Perey turnstiles. New, Motorola Indala proximity cards will be issued, which will be read by Motorola Indala readers when the holder places them just above the turnstiles. Visitors will be issued plastic photo ID cards with magnetic stripes that they will swipe through readers. The contractors for the permanent security system are E.J. Electric and Electronic Systems Associates, both of New York. Securacom, Woodcliff Lakes, N.J., is responsible for system integration. Also, ASSA of Brooklyn, N.Y., is installing a new key system. The UL437-approved, high-security cylinders and keys contain a proprietary keyway. Each cylinder and key has a bar code imbedded in it. A Qualisoft software control system for issuance of the keys includes remote, hand-held and fixed-location scanners that scan employee ID cards and then scan the key to make sure the key and the person match. All key rings are also weighed before daily distribution to make sure they have not been tampered with.
(MANY MORE DETAILS - a definite must-read for all those who are interested in this subject)
http://securitysolutions.com/mag/security_world_trade_c... /
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So, Securacom clearly has an important role - system integration for the systems authorizing individual access to the buildings. It's a far cry from them "being in control of security," as the simplification goes, but it's very easy to imagine that they would be aware of ways of circumventing the system, creating false authorizations, etc. - This would presumably be true of several other contractors, and of course the Port Authority itself. After July 1, it would also be true of Silverstein. And it would no doubt be true generally of the federal law enforcement tenants of any of the buildings (i.e., FBI, Treasury, etc.) All these would be good places for a "nest of evildoers" to develop.
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
Why did this get voted down?
Accuracy is important. As Nicholas said, playing loose with the facts just gives debunkers room to attack.
On that note, two of the hijackers lived with an FBI INFORMANT, not an FBI AGENT.
Scott
"ended in 2000"
Are you sure it was the normal calendar year of 2000 or the fiscal year?
I have heard a few times the fiscal year of 2000 is when Stratesec stopped. Fiscal years can often run deep into the next year.
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"The most perfidious way of harming a cause consists of defending it deliberately with faulty arguments."
Friedrich Nietzsche, The Gay Science, section 191
German philosophe
Thank you
Very much for pointing this out before we put our order in. We have officially ommitted this fact, as we want to retain upmost credibility and accuracy. I will post a revision soon!
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the
only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Mr. Cipirol
(Also, they employed Jerome Hauer!)
He's the one who told the WH to start taking Cipirol on 9/11 right - well before the Anthrax attacks. I have heard this from different sources but never seen it refuted.
--
Truth Revolution: The Eleventh of Every Month
Another view
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/911security.html
9/11 Security Courtesy of Marvin Bush
"How could they let this happen? They knew this building was a target. Over the past few weeks we'd been evacuated a number of times, which is unusual. I think they had an inkling something was going on." [People] http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/people.html
Marvin P. Bush, the president’s younger brother, was a principal in a company called Securacom that provided security for the World Trade Center, United Airlines, and Dulles International Airport. The company, Burns noted, was backed by KuwAm, a Kuwaiti-American investment firm on whose board Marvin Burns also served. [Utne]
http://www.utne.com/web_special/web_specials_2003-02/articles/10292-1.html
According to its present CEO, Barry McDaniel, the company had an ongoing contract to handle security at the World Trade Center "up to the day the buildings fell down."
The company lists as government clients "the U.S. Army, U.S. Navy, U.S Air force, and the Department of Justice," in projects that "often require state-of-the-art security solutions for classified or high-risk government sites."
Stratesec (Securacom) differs from other security companies which separate the function of consultant from that of service provider. The company defines itself as a "single-source" provider of "end-to-end" security services, including everything from diagnosis of existing systems to hiring subcontractors to installing video and electronic equipment. It also provides armored vehicles and security guards.
The Dulles Internation contract is another matter. Dulles is regarded as "absolutely a sensitive airport," according to security consultant Wayne Black, head of a Florida-based security firm, due to its location, size, and the number of international carriers it serves.
Black has not heard of Stratesec, but responds that for one company to handle security for both airports and airlines is somewhat unusual. It is also delicate for a security firm serving international facilities to be so interlinked with a foreign-owned company: "Somebody knew somebody," he suggested, or the contract would have been more closely scrutinized.
As Black points out, "when you [a company] have a security contract, you know the inner workings of everything." And if another company is linked with the security company, then "What's on your computer is on their computer." [American Reporter]
A heightened WTC security alert was lifted on 9/6/2001...The World Trade Center was destroyed just days after a heightened security alert was lifted at the landmark 110-story towers, security personnel said yesterday [September 11]. Daria Coard, 37, a guard at Tower One, said the security detail had been working 12-hour shifts for the past two weeks because of numerous phone threats. But on Thursday [September 6], bomb-sniffing dogs were abruptly removed. [NY Newsday]
...there was a power down in WTC 2 the weekend before 9/11...On the weekend of 9/8, 9/9 there was a 'power down' condition in WTC tower 2, the south tower. This power down condition meant there was no electrical supply for approx 36 hrs from floor 50 up... "Of course without power there were no security cameras, no security locks on doors and many, many 'engineers' coming in and out of the tower." [WingTV] http://69.28.73.17/thornarticles/powerdown.html
...Bush's cousin had a fortunate change of venue for a September 11 business conference...
President Bush's cousin should have been in the World Trade Centre when it was attacked. Jim Pierce, managing director of AON Corporations, had arranged a business conference on the 105th floor of the South Tower where its New York offices were based. But his group was too large so they decided to move across the street to the Millennium Hotel. [Annova]
http://web.archive.org/web/20040411172330/http:/www.ananova.com/news/sto...
...and it just so happens that Marvin was in New York on 9/11.
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/bush_newyork_9-11.html
Both WTC 6 and WTC 7 were evacuated within minutes of Flight 11 striking WTC 1, but this did not happen in the twin towers. There were no evacuation announcements in WTC 1 following the plane strike, and workers were encouraged to stay in their building...
Dan Baumbach - WTC 1 Survivor:Dan Baumbach, 24, a software engineer from Merrick, was stunned to find that building officials in One World Trade Center were telling workers not to evacuate even after the first jet struck. "You can try it, but it's at your own risk," he quoted one official as telling a group of 100 people on the 75th floor. Many chose to follow that advice; Baumbach continued his descent from the 80th floor and survived, but only after braving the debris that fell when the neighboring tower collapsed. "The reason we got out was because we didn't listen," he said. [Newsday]
This information...
Tells you why Stratesec/Securacom is an interesting line of research - alongide the other security providers at WTC. Marvin Bush and Wirt Walker should be called to testify and throw open details of their dealings, yes.
None of this tells you that Securacom "ran" WTC security, which is the untrue claim repeated over and over.
QUOTE: "Black has not heard of Stratesec, but responds that for one company to handle security for both airports and airlines is somewhat unusual."
But they didn't "handle" security at WTC on 9/11 and they weren't responsible for the announcements not to evacuate the towers.
And then you add more interesting info that, however, is unrelated to Securacom.
Nor can anyone show Securacom were responsible for this VERY interesting fact, which I have heard corroborated from other sources: "Daria Coard, 37, a guard at Tower One, said the security detail had been working 12-hour shifts for the past two weeks because of numerous phone threats. But on Thursday [September 6], bomb-sniffing dogs were abruptly removed. [NY Newsday]."
Otherwise: do you really believe a WTC tower was "dark to the world" (!) from floor 50 up on the weekend before 9/11 and only one guy in the world noticed afterward and there are no pictures of this alleged power down condition? In the case of such a visible anomaly, thousands would have noticed and it would have been reported (like the bomb-sniffing dogs and the 12-hour shifts). Noticing such an obvious fact would not make you into a whistleblower or entail any danger to you.
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
Don't bury good research
Don't bury good research- just because you don't have the time to look into it (as Nicholas has). If he is wrong about his facts, post a correction with respect. Too much myth making does little to help the Truth movement. Facts are facts.
Divisive Labels
While I respect your right to disagree on the merits of controlled demolition or criticize a lack of focus on other types of evidence, the sarcastic label "church" is just as divisive as the people who attack other lines of evidence as not being worthy of consideration while using similarly divisive labels without argument.
I also support Nicholas' well presented criticisms above. But, I think all areas of research are worthy of consideration.
Disinformation and the Misleading and False LIHOP/MIHOP Dichotomy
______________________________
http://arabesque911.blogspot.com
yeah maybe Nicholas has done
yeah maybe Nicholas has done his research but frankly his approach to 'enlightening' us is quite condescending and not very friendly.
maybe if he put on a happy face before he posted his critiques Abby would take them more seriously?
Its one thing to correct someone but to if you do it with a very poor attitude people are bound to ignore you
Taken seriously
It looks like Abby is taking them seriously, even in the absence of a happy face. See her 'Thank you' reply above.
Just what we need, another
Just what we need, another merchandise outlet in the 9/11 Truth Movement. (that was sarcasm)
$20 for a white t-shirt with a black screen print, and only $1 donated to Feal Good?
I'd be more harsh if you girls weren't cute.
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Merchandising
I don't work for the alex man but my father proudly wear's this shirt which is my favorite:
http://infowars-shop.stores.yahoo.net/9injobinsp.html
sorry bro
if we didn't spend a grand on the site and if we weren't putting ourselves out monetarily in many other ways with this then maybe we would lower the costs. This is not for us to be making a PROFIT. How is this different than any other American Apparell shirt costs? The loose change guys charge the same amount for their shirts and I don't hear you bitching about the price.
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Will it be possible to get some Hollywood Truthers to support?
It would be wonderful if the Hollywood Truthers would use their public image in support of 911 Truth Fundraising.
Some of this was done recently in the 9-11-2007 WeAreChange events in NYC, but how about the West Coast?
It would be great if some of the big name Hollywood Stars get seriously involved in supporting fundraising efforts for the 1st Responders at the same time spreading the message of 911 Truth.
Would you consider contacting them and asking them for support?
This will be another dimension in PATRIOTISM.
What use is the millions when the dollar is tanking, the Der Decider and Friends are rushing their police state and tearing the Constitution apart and probably planning more Wars & False Flag Events.
This is NOT going to go away unless we put a full stop to it.
Sincerely believe the Hollywood Truthers should do more.
By that, I include Mel Gibson, Bruce Willis.
They know. Just don't openly talk about it.
Hmmmm.
Its safer to go public.
Because this thing is going to blow wide open.
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The CONSTITUTION is NOT going to "collapse" into pulverized dust no matter how much thermate/explosives or planes they throw at it
Yeah.
QUOTE:
"A super truther is an individual committed to disseminating truth to their family and peers, their friends and strangers. We want individuals dedicated to exposing the lies and terrorist acts created and supported by the United States government. If you're a leader, outspoken or simply want to enact positive, constructive change for our society, please, sign up today!
"As an enrolled and approved super truther you'll have greater input and responsibilites than a normal truther would."
http://www.truther.org/action/superTruthers.html
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Golly, can I really get some prettygirl, oops, um, more input and responsibility than a NORMAL Truther?! (Her pics are really charming by the way, but the boy-mannequin needs to acquire some kind of expression. Or is that un-manly? Can we stick a cig on him, at least? Never mind, this is CA.)
Hell, yeah! I don't want to be no NORMAL Truther!!!
T-shirts are $20 - but hey a buck goes to FealGood. (Can you think of an alternative wherein FealGood gets $20, truther.org gets zero, and you don't have to pose like a friggin' style zombie in the t-shirt? I can!)
Now we get to see how many in the ostensible 9/11 skeptics' ranks recognize the launch of a clothing line and prospective San Diego strip boutique. (Oi, we could have ALL been selling friggin' t-shirts from Nov. 2001 forward. "Too soon," my ass - another profit center gone to the more enterprising.)
Forgot: the obligatory A.Jones endorsement. This page is perfect!
Site contact: a form.
WHOIS: Registered via Australian proxy with e-mail contact davidchasetaylor at yahoo.com.
Here's who that might be: http://9-11.meetup.com/279/members/4742088/
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
WHOIS lookup on nicholas:
WHOIS lookup on nicholas: a person on 9/11 blogger that i rarely ever have the patience to read through his meandering nit picky essay long posts
Aw gosh,
Guess I'm locked out of the prom again!
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
haha
agreed who is this guy? all he does is insult me and the site when his website is literally unreadable and boring as hell. i've never even heard of him before but I am sure he is doing LOTS and LOTS for the movement (like writing boring blogs on blogger that no one ever reads)
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Psychedelic Artist! Rock
Psychedelic Artist!
Rock out.
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www.thirdworldtraveler.com
Always do!
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Are you for real?
Yeah, that's the spirit! Tear down the good efforts of those trying to spread the truth fighting for a passionate cause. What are you doing for the cause besides sitting at your keyboard and typing your "clever" point by point responses; great contributions, by the way (yeah, that was sarcasm..) Too bad there are people out there that feel compelled in ruining someone else's accomplishments (perhaps the hidden agenda manifests itself in the fact that they haven't done anything themselves?).
Abby great webpage i think
Abby great webpage i think this really raises the bar as far as presentation goes with 9/11 websites. keep up the good work your group is doing in san diego!
I second that.
Agreed.
Just in. Some great Truth Action in Sweden.
http://truthaction.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2588
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The CONSTITUTION is NOT going to "collapse" into pulverized dust no matter how much thermate/explosives or planes they throw at it
Great job!
Great job! Those pictures are awesome. Thanks for putting yourself out there to spread the word.
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Just to clarify
Those photos are from our fellow Truthers from Sweden.
I posted the most recent, up to date photos from truthaction.org to keep people aware of the current activities.
Pls visit their website: http://vaken.se/
I am from Malaysia.
Over here, we have to LOOK REAL HARD for people who trust Bush or believe the Official Story.
Kind of impossible. EVERYONE KNOWS over here.
My government knows. Pls see: www. william911.com
Honourable Dato’ Seri Syed Hamid Albar, Minister of Foreign Affairs of Malaysia and Rodriguez
Former Prime Minister of Malaysia Dr Tun Mahatdir Mohammed holding the WTC Master key
and William Rodriguez July 2006
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The CONSTITUTION is NOT going to "collapse" into pulverized dust no matter how much thermate/explosives or planes they throw at it
thanks for clarifying
it is amazing how many people are awake abroad.
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Clarity
The San Diego group is one of the best I have seen (Abby et al), but I'm not sure of the graphics of the "Truther" banner, that appears ghost-like, when total clarity is needed. We don't want to look vague, specter-like, or X-File inspired IMHO. Truth is a clear beacon. Thanks folks- keep up the good work!
thanks
thanks for the suggestion, we are still tweaking things with the site and want feedback to make it better
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Not to knock your point but
I like the design. It certainly caught my eye.
Good job on the website!
http://www.uspto.gov/main/trademarks.htm
Brilliant.
I think the 9/11 Truth for Dummies concept is brilliant. We need to wash this overwhelming topic down to the bottom line. And make it digestible for the common man. The site is great and I like a place where I can find cool merchandise. I haven't bought any clothing yet, but it is nice to have a place where I can if I want. And I'm glad Abby's running it. I agree with the text and message, the wording on those cards is great. We need to keep the message bold and not too mysterious like 7man said.
To our victory. The masses are waking up. There's a rumbling in the town. I'm hoping a critical and determined mass can and will be achieved soon. Peace.
Thanks!
Thank you for everyone who is supporting the website and making suggestions on how to make it better or more credible (we will work on re-doing the Stratesec info on the flier) . We are putting ourselves out there and have dedicated our lives to this cause. All I spend my money on is this movement. Every cent made on any merchandise is being funneled right back into 9/11 truth. And for the "truthers" who just sit behind their computers criticizing and making fun of it, why don't you realize that we are ALL in this cause together, and I am just trying out new, inventive ways to disseminate the information and make people aware of who we are. Why don't you get off your ass and do something in the STREETS instead of blog all day?
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
The website looks EXCELLENT and what I have seen and know...
very CREDIBLE too !!!
Some "critics" would not be happy until every website, book and documentary reflected the 9/11 Commission Report...
I (and I'm sure many others) really appreciate what you folks do, I can only speak for myself but would like to send my sincerest thanks to all you guys and gals in San Diego et all !!!
Very best wishes to you all
thanks for checking out the
thanks for checking out the site 911vertias, i really appreciate positive feedback for the efforts of my sister. Its real 9/11 truthers like you make this movement worth being part of, other people who write essay long critiques without one positive comment....not so much ;-). constructive criticism is fine, but cynacism and just plain rudeness saddens me when all of us are basically on the same team.
911veritas, your WTC7 bbc discovery was very important to the movement and myself , and i hope some day i can contribute something as profound
Go abby! go san diego 9/11 truth! , 9/11 truth for dummies i have to say is the best pamphlet style 9/11 fact sheet ive ever seen, but i would recommend correcting the small part about the FBI agent to informant. ;-)
My pleasure...
I'm not sure if it's any consolation (maybe it's a hidden compliment having him post a "review"), but my initial BBC postings received a similar critical review by Nicholas...
"Yes, 911blogger took it down - maybe because it's TROLL BAIT!"
Link : http://www.911blogger.com/node/6400#comment-119517
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I take a lot of this with a pinch of salt :-{)
Keep up the great work dude, you have a very special sister !!!
Best wishes
Yes
I know the feeling.
Getting attacked for no good reason just for trying to get some information across.
O Well. We live and we learn.
Thanks for your link http://www.911blogger.com/node/6400#comment-119517.
It is eye opening how the video obviously shows WTC 7 behind the BBC reporter as she "claims" it has collapsed. It is going to.
They screwed up.
Using a time zone difference to attack such evidence is classic strawman.
Thanks for pointing this out.
Strawman is all they have left.
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The CONSTITUTION is NOT going to "collapse" into pulverized dust no matter how much thermate/explosives or planes they throw at it
:D
Thanks Veritas, means a lot to realize our efforts. And to all the miserable folk tearing the concept down should know that EVERY time I wear the truther shirt all I get is inquisition from people around me of what "truther" means. It has a tremendous success in starting up the conversation! (Especially when we go out in packs). Why can't we incorporate a "cool" element to this movement? We will never reach the apathetic youth if we don't appeal to them in some way. Peace and love to you friend.
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Part of Nicholas' problem
that he's not saying here (but is saying here at the TruthMove forum ) is that he considers the term "truther" to be derogatory -- a "trivializing" term "invented to mock 9/11 skeptics. " And all this time I thought it was the invention of Jon Gold.
Cool is a big part of what moves memes.
wtcdemolition.com/blog
Cool
...is also a great way to create ossified cliques with mindless stances on either side.
Cool always generates several flavors of anti-cool and cooler-than-thou.
Cool is high school.
Cool is something that, when all resources are mobilized, the corporate media can master. If they get outmaneuvered by cool from below, they pull out a fat checkbook and buy it.
Cool is a potential that's been pretty much tapped at this point on behalf of 9/11 truth. I'll take a high-level whistleblower or the beans spilled by a foreign intel agency as more effective.
(And if I didn't post more criticism here it's because, well, even I know the meaning of enough, the kids mean well, how much curmudgeon should I play, etc. etc.)
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
Curmudgeon
It's hard not to drift towards "Curmudgeon" when looking into this dark material- so I'm all for "Cool" as long as it enhances the message in the long run. I appreciate solid research, as well as, thougthtful activists such as the San Diego group, who have attracted much deserved attention with their fresh approach. Perhaps, It's time to move away from the black shirt look, folks. Just keep getting the message to the public- great job!
Ah! I see :)
I am wholeheartedly against and don't understand the whole divide and conquer attitude that has torn apart this movement, but at least now I understand more why my efforts were getting belittled so much.
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Veritas...
Yes, that was a mistake I made, back then.
It was prompted by your own mistake - you put a false time zone label in your video, you may remember, which made me think you were intentionally misleading about the time. You were not doing this intentionally, however. You were only making a mistake, and my initial response was vicious.
That is why I apologized to you at length the same day:
http://911blogger.com/node/6485
Then I wrote up the coverage in 911Truth.org of your discovery, with due credit given to you and to its significance:
http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20070228173157804
(I don't consider that a "waste of time!")
Now you don't have to accept my apologies or acts of contrition - but if you're going to dredge up this ancient stuff, you do have to tell the whole story.
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
Exactly...
That's all I was trying to state...
No-one is PERFECT, and we are all vulnerable to making MISTAKES !!!
Let him cast the first stone... and all that... but I'll always try my best never to throw the baby out with the dirty bath water, which I believe is a good thorough and scientific method to practice.
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and there you go again... you say FALSE (which in my book is a deliberate act), where it was an ERROR.
Maybe it is just your tone, if you were more constructive with your criticisms you wouldn't rub folks up the wrong way.
Anyway, I can't help having a good memory and I don't hold any grudge.
Best wishes to ya
your book, I don't know...
but in the dictionary false has several meanings, including "incorrect" which is the one I intended. Okay?
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
Good for you
"All I spend my money is on this movement," you say. And you know what? That's true of lots of people here. Most of us are bankrupting ourselves through our interest in 9/11 justice, and your outlay is no more reason for you to claim a high ground than anyone else's. It justifies nothing in itself. I was out on the street and organizing events for 9/11 truth in 2002, where were you? Does that make you immune to criticism?
You never heard of me? That's all right, because I never heard of you either, when suddenly today this site is presented from you that is all style, no substance - buy the t-shirt! - and you don't even identify yourselves or the authors of your recycled material.
Get all your facts straight at least - glad you're going to make a try on Stratesec - and maybe I'll love it, too.
I am not taking this personally and neither should you:
The reality is, your site to many outside observers will looks as though its primary function is to sell apparel. If you think biting at me will change that, well fine.
The t-shirt doesn't even have a political message, like "Investigate 9/11", but an identity message: I'm a "truther," ergo cool. And what's that "super truther" not NORMAL truther stuff? Can it get more clubbish?
My hope is you do improve.
Good thing you're not wasting any time writing boring posts here, by the way. By what magic do your posts get written, that it takes no time?
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
truthiness
good lord. I bet the moment 9/11 truth shirts land at Hot Topic you will be bitching up a storm :D
A quote from John Albanese
From : John Albanese (http://911blogger.com/user/502)
http://911blogger.com/node/6485#comment-119973
Start Quote.
"........to those who do not know Nicholas he was one of the founders of NY911Truth - 4 years back. it is entirely possible that none of us would even be here if not for his organizing over the years.
you could say Nicholas is one of the deans of this movement - one of the elder tribesmen - who has seen sham after sham after sham foisted on us by the purveyors of disinformation. he's seen it all. the pods. the flashes. the plane switches. the pentagon. and now TVFakery and Space Beams.
Nicholas continues to maintain the highest standards of research and integrity. he simply will not cave in to populist ideas - instead opting to thoroughly scrutinize and vet all sources and schools of thought. he is one of a select few in this movement who can be consistently counted on to present evidence in the most empirical, experiential and pragmatic way.
To those who find his 'style' a little gruff and superior - those of us who know him understand that he is simply a big sincere pain in the ass." End Quote
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Well Nicholas, if that is the case, I would like to thank you for your efforts at NY911 Truth. All things said and done, we are ALL in this together and sincerely hope any misunderstandings can be solved.
Thank You and have a Good Day.
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The CONSTITUTION is NOT going to "collapse" into pulverized dust no matter how much thermate/explosives or planes they throw at it
thank you
It's very kind of you to dig that up - and John was really too kind. To be honest, I've also had my share of blunders (see above for one) and I just hope the net effect of my efforts was for the better.
Anyway - you know what? I suspect truther.org is an honest effort. The problem is, in its coolness and t-shirt emphasis it looks like commercial exploitation. Maybe they will tone it down.
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
don't count on it. the
don't count on it. the first sentence uttered was about how they'll have more stuff for sale.
I really suggest folks take a look at the "debunking efforts" going on here:
http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=98603
Aesthetically pleasing sites with some links and text doesn't make it credible. And anyone chastized for their scrutiny does not deserve that treatment.
/////////////////////
www.thirdworldtraveler.com
I respect your view on this
but it's hard to escape the fact that the website looks pretty cool and hip. You've got to admit, a lot of 9/11 truth, on it's face, is kinda dry -- particularly, in my experience, for those in their teens and twenty-somethings. Although imperfect, I think it's fair to say that truther.org is headed in a nice direction of many diversified directions. There's room enough for different approaches to 9/11 truth. What I just don't want to see is infighting over titles and whatnot. I'll come straight out and ask: I had this idea that each of us could write a series of fiction (or non-fiction) stories about our experiences with 9/11 truth (or stories about what we think MIGHT have happened on 9/11 -- skies the limit) and publish them in a volume called either "9/11 truther" or -- you guessed it -- "Truther". Is anyone going to complain if I use either of those titles?
BTW, no, this writing project was not something I wanted to do alone. In order for it to get done right, I think it would have to have a group effort. You know, how someone starts a story, and when they can't finish it, they pass it along (like a chain story [is that the correct term?]). Or stories of different characters running concurrent with each other. These are just ideas. Any takers? I'd go first, if you like (but mine would likely be a combination of fiction and non-fiction, a mix of what has happened and what I would like to happen). We could put eventually the compilation on a website and call it: "Stories of 9/11 Truth" or something like that. Again, just an idea.
Things have gotten a little weird around here, so I gotta say this: Please don't vote me down. :(
Aww
Sorry you feel that way, because our efforts are indeed genuine. And we worked really hard on all the pre and post 9/11 evidence on the site with all hard facts. It has a lot of substance. But thank you for your opinion, I just need to get a tougher skin! Oh, that huffington link didn't work? Keep up the great job DHS and thanks for everything you do.
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
So you will
or will not throw the book at me if any collection of short stories I compile is called "Truther"? ;)
I support
every effort of every truther finding new ways to disseminate the truth. i think its a great idea Ranzz!
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Oh, and Abby...
Show me where I insulted YOU. (Is this the "how dare you" defense?)
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"Truth is not measured in mass appeal."
summeroftruth.org
Nicholas
I don't want to waste any more time belittling each other's efforts. You said your piece and I appreciate your opinion. I am sorry for reacting in the first place to it. Good luck with everything, keep up the great work and let's continue to utilize our energy in a positive way!
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Top Headlines from Major Sites All In One Place!
I love it.
Now if only you had a comprehensive TRUTH Radio Guide.
What's on, When, Where.
GREAT idea!
Can't believe we forgot to include that!
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush
Are you reffering to the
Are you reffering to the website that shows up when clicking on the "truth News" menu item?
http://TruthFeeds.com/9-11
jhf
Truther.org needs an "anonymous emailer"
ubmitted by chucksheen on Wed, 11/14/2007 - 9:43am.
UniversalSeed.org
9/11 | anonymous emailer | documentaries | Resources | truther tool
I like and support http://UniversalSeed.org. It has an anonymous emailer on the left column. You can send others an email that they will receive from the site allowing you to remain anonymous. Unfortunately the emailer only supports 1 email address at a time so no batch jobs. Try to review all the material including the Constitution Class, which is available if you click the "We The People" image of The Constitution. You can submit material, make suggestions and more.
revised flier
"I will not withdraw from this war even if Laura and Barney are the only ones supporting me." -George W. Bush