Historic 9/11 Debate with Bigard, Laurent, Kassovitz and Harrit on French TV
world911truth Mon, 10/19/2009 - 5:00am
Historic 9/11 Debate with Bigard, Laurent, Kassovitz and Harrit on French TV
by World for 9/11 Truth
You have until October 28 to learn French because French TV France 2's "L'objet du scandale" with Guillaume Durand will air a historic debate over the official version of the 9/11 events.
On one side: 4 people with the hard task to defend the official version. On the other side, Jean-Marie Bigard, Mathieu Kassovitz, Éric Laurent and special guest Niels Harrit will tell France and the world why they don't support the official theory and why they find it disturbing.
Read the article: http://world911truth.org/historic-911-debate-with-bigard-laurent-kassovitz-and-harrit-on-french-tv/
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I've got chills!
This should be incredible!
With you in the struggle,
Bruno
WeAreChangeLA - http://www.wacla.org
CNN will look like pretend news
after this airs. Whenever I watch American news these days I think "that's interesting but what about 9/11?" How long can they ignore the elephant in the room?
They are
I read somewhere that Jon Stewart is the most respected journalist in America and he's billed as doing pretend news.
It seems the comedians on both sides of the pond are best suited to get people to wake up.
May you live in interesting times.
Tip
Harrit and others, if you are reading this, invoke the 9/11 commissioners' own statements, as frequently as humanly possible.
http://www.911blogger.com/node/20218
A conspiracy is a crime committed by two or more people. A criminal cover-up constitutes a conspiracy. Therefore, there was a criminal conspiracy involving the 9/11 commission. Such a conspiracy is just as outrageous as a conspiracy to co-opt a terrorist attack and enhance it by monitoring and infiltrating the terrorist cell to ensure its success, blowing up buildings and sabotaging air defense. Also, BE SURE to point out the parallels to the Moscow apartment bombings and also repeatedly, repeatedly mention the anthrax attacks and the links to Jerome Hauer.
These points are necessary to drive the spin doctors into a corner. Hard. Force these people to comment on the comments of the 9/11 commissioners and ask them whether or not they find this acceptable in light of the enormous effects of 9/11 on the world. Do so over and over.
When the objection "somebody would have talked" is raised, DO NOT say: "Well some projects were kept secret, such as the Manhattan project, etc. etc.", but PLEASE remind these people that EVERYBODY WAS TALKING. BEFORE and AFTER.
"Leader follows leader from bad to worse, as though by a malign law of nature. One ruler, evil or stupid or violent, breeds another more evil or stupid or violent." — Liz McAlister
Anthrax and Moscow bombings?
I don't know if raising these issues when there is so much basic 9/11 evidence to present makes sense. These are nuanced connections that require you to first grasp that 9/11 was a conspiracy before they can be appreciated for their own significance. Don't we risk playing into their hands as people who see conspiracy in everything by making these connections (which I'm not saying aren't valid)?
I trust this panel to make best use of the TV time afforded; it will be fascinating to see what they do focus upon.
The antrax attacks were
The antrax attacks were false flag attacks. There is a direct link to 9/11. The Moscow apartment bombings in September 1999 were conducted by the FSB and subsequently blamed on separatists from Chechnya to provide a justification for war. Both are excellent and near irrefutable examples (Senator Leahy's public comments to FBI director Mueller) of false flag attacks and provide precedent. It's important to underscore that we are not talking about crop circles, UFOs or moon landings, but about terrorist attacks, military incidents and assassinations. The latter category is entirely different and history is replete with examples. It is important to establish the reality and context of government attacks on their own populus. Not providing this context provides the other party with means to isolate 9/11 truth as a fringe topic.
Especially the comments about the 9/11 commission are irrefutable and damning. I don't necessarily trust this panel to make these points: I expect a rehash of tired and failed debating strategies (long big tent discussion about the Pentagon, for example, or the "hijackers and islamic terror don't exist" nonsense.) I'm charging, but I believe there are better arguments and points to made that are essentially untouchable. That's how you drive a liar into a corner: leave him no wiggling room.
If I hear anybody say that Marvin Bush was "in charge of security at the WTC on 9/11" and that "Wirt D. Walker III was Bush's cousin", I'm going to be very, very unhappy because these are good examples of claims that are factually incorrect yet constantly repeated. If that happens, it's going to make the 9/11 truth panel sitting ducks for powerful rebuttal.
Another blunder is not mentioning that everybody knew and talked about 9/11 beforehand, demolishing the excuse that nobody talked. Instead, we seem to prefer arguing that covert operations can be successfully kept secret. While this is true, it was NOT the case for 9/11. The news even made it to Bill Cooper and Alex Jones BEFORE 9/11, FFS. There is a plethora of other such incidents and examples.
"Leader follows leader from bad to worse, as though by a malign law of nature. One ruler, evil or stupid or violent, breeds another more evil or stupid or violent." — Liz McAlister
"I believe there are better
"I believe there are better arguments and points to made that are essentially untouchable. That's how you drive a liar into a corner: leave him no wiggling room. "
I agree, SnowCrash. But could you point to some examples of better arguments and points?
Also, if someone challenges the assertion that 9/11was being talked about prior to the event, who could be named other than Jones and Cooper?
Thank you.
Examples
See my comment post below, with a transcript of an interview with Bob Graham. I think it deserves its own blog post to be honest, but as long as you guys get to see it what I saw...on TV last September. There's usually a flurry of anti-truth hit job documentaries on European TV yearly around 9/11..
ETA:
As to your other question wrt talking, some examples:
Before:
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,1437518;root=news,10167;mode=flat (Recommended to look up "xinoehpoel" in the original Google Groups postings that explicitly name the date of the attacks and point to the US government as the culprit ("Look no further than your own government"))
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/december2005/161205Haglund.htm
http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a090601dilorenzo#a090601d...
http://www.prisonplanet.com/ex-cia-man-warned-top-executives-to-leave-ne... (Original source, foreign policy news, taken down)
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/04_04_02_vree_intervw.html
(et cetera, et cetera, the volume of this evidence is enormous)
Afterwards:
http://www.daanspeak.com/BizarreBerichten02.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43Y3B__mXzU
"Leader follows leader from bad to worse, as though by a malign law of nature. One ruler, evil or stupid or violent, breeds another more evil or stupid or violent." — Liz McAlister
9/11 commisioner's comments
are absolutely among the most damning and easily verified points, so we've got no disagreement there. Not even disagreeing about Anthrax and Moscow, just wary of giving these guys anything to use in painting the panel as conspiracy theorists who find conspiracy in everything.
Thanks for raising the AJ foreknowledge. What is the exact story that Alex Jones reported before sept 11? I recall hearing about this but never got the full story.
For example
See this German documentary at time mark 41:20. Bob Graham, chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee on 9/11, speaks.
I'll transcribe from German (I am forced to quote the German voice over) and then translate. My German is reasonable (I'm Dutch, not German), but I apologize in advance for any errors.
Translation:
If anybody has a version of this where we can hear Graham without the German voice over, please post it. I would like Graham's verbatim English words.
Somehow, German television thinks this limited hangout incompetence theory bullshit will calm me down and resolve my questions. However, Bob Graham himself is saying there was a criminal conspiracy to cover up 9/11! And I am supposed to be okay with this because it supposedly "less bad" than "MIHOP"? I am outraged, and I think this remark by former senator Graham should be quoted repeatedly to our opponents, reminding them that the government conspiracy to cover-up 9/11 is FACT, but is the EXTENT of this cover up and the conspiracy that is up for debate. PERIOD.
What the hell are Graham and German television thinking?!? That I am okay with this?! Have they gone loop-de-loop? If anything, this is the tip of the iceberg and therefore an outright scandalous remark. I saw this last 9/11 "anniversary" on German TV late at night and I will tell you I was beside myself with anger.
"Leader follows leader from bad to worse, as though by a malign law of nature. One ruler, evil or stupid or violent, breeds another more evil or stupid or violent." — Liz McAlister
Fully agree
I referred to the Moscow bombings in my writing published in Finland's Skeptikko (=Skeptic) magazine. It should be noted that the fifth, unexploded bomb was declared to have been just part of an antiterrorism exercise - *after* it had been traced to the FSB.
As regards the anthrax attacks, they consisted of anthrax letters allegedly sent my muslims, but the anthrax was traced to a US military laboratory, after which the FBI has been trying to blame them on some individual government scientist. The attacks shortly followed 9/11 and targeted Democratic leaders trying to halt the Patriot Act legislation. I think the anthrax attacks should be mentioned much more often by the truth community.
It is very important to make it clear that 9/11 is not an isolated event.
Hauer
A co-worker of mine videotaped 12 hours of CBS on 9/11 and 6 hours on 9/12. He started watching these tapes the same day he first watched WTC7 collapse. The next day he came in and said the Dan Rather Jerry Hauer interview sealed the deal for him. Do you have any tips on where to research the Hauer 911 and anthrax connection?
Yes
Sander Hicks: The “Mad Scientist” Ivins, and Other 9/11 Legends
"Leader follows leader from bad to worse, as though by a malign law of nature. One ruler, evil or stupid or violent, breeds another more evil or stupid or violent." — Liz McAlister
Also informative
Re anthrax attacks, Hauer, Fort Detrick, Project Jefferson, etc./et al., I also found this to be very informative:
http://911blogger.com/node/17928
Where are they going to find
Where are they going to find 4 people who are prepared to publicly defend the indefensible without looking like idiots? They will be facing a formidable opposition, and will find themselves in a tough spot no matter what question is asked.
Have they not found these people yet?
They mentioned the names of the Truth side but not the opposition.
waouh !
je parle francais- j'ai etudie la bas a lyon !
cest super !
D
Mais Oui !
Looks interesting. And looks like the show will be posted on their site.
....pass the Freedom Fries !
"....pass the Freedom Fries !"
"....pass the Freedom Fries !"
LOL Ouch I am laughing so hard! Can't wait for this!
With you in the struggle,
Bruno
WeAreChangeLA - http://www.wacla.org
comment faire?
il leur faudra quatre gens prets a jouer l'advocat du diable en defendrent le version officiel
ca veut pas dire qu'ils y croient
cest le moyen le plus pratique pour faire marcher ce truc
D
en attendant regarde mon
en attendant regarde mon petit connerie d'youtube:
j'ai adjoute une carte et de la musique de rap
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBWy5Eq6bRc
ca marche?
Please call for big manifestion 11th nov 2009 (29th Onze Bouge)
John A MITCHELL
Herblay FRANCE
bonsoir ,
Great news! Thank you Mahtieu Kassovitz, Éric Laurent , Jean-Marie Bigard and Niels Harrit for taking up the 911 truth word on France 2, "L'Objet Du Scandale" , Guillaume Durand, Wednesday the 28th of Octobre 2009 between 22h15 to 00h20 French Time. For far too long the 911 debate has been forbidden in France !
You can expect ad hominems attacks but you are getting used to it and you will certainly be less unstabled by them as in the past. France 2 has still a long way to go to do their job and inform correctly the public on this tabou subject. I meet up with some of the France 2 personnel on the 11th of September 2009 ( 27th Onze Bouge) and they were not all closed to discussion.
http://www.911blogger.com/node/21403
The 11th of November 2009 will be our "29e Onze Bouge" "29th Every Eleventh of the month" action in France and will also be a public holiday for "L'Armistice" day of the first world war. A war which many had tried to avoid. The French Jean Jarurès paid for his life trying to prevent the 1st world war when he called the train workers , etc to go on strike so that the war would be impossible to carry out. But he was killed before his call could be printed in the newspaper "Humanité".
So why can we not, this next 11th of November have a call on Guillaume Durand's TV programme for a peace manifestation to end the war in Afghanistan and Irak ? The exposed lies of 911 will end these wars ! Could you, sometime in this programme, make a call for the 29th "Onze Bouge" at Paris ?
. http://www.google.fr/#hl=fr&q=Onze+bouge+911blogger&meta=&fp=3873581dfba...
. http://www.google.fr/#hl=fr&q=eleventh+of+each+month+truth+action+world+...
It will have to be offically organised ( by http://agircontrelaguerre.free.fr/, ..., reopen911.info ?) and an autorisation obtained from the Prefecture of Police.
We had an exceptionnal 28th "Onze Bouge" "Eleventh of each month" last week
. http://www.911blogger.com/node/21659
why not have an even bigger peace manifestation this coming 11th of November "REMEMBRANCE PEACE DAY for Afghanistan and Irak" ?
Yours
John
PS If we are successful there will be no French troops willing to be part of a war crime and poor Nicolas Sarkozy will have to send his kinglet son to Afghanistan instead of the Defense of Paris !
The debate is already won
The official talkiing point is that the government conspiracy theory is not debateable. That's what Bush said, and that's what Obama said. The fact of having the debate, proves that the subject IS debateable - at least to those participatiing, and to those sponsoring.
So the debate is already won --- as it disproves that the subject is not debateable.
Don't worry about "blunders." EVERYTHING the defense of the government story has will be a blunder.
The truth has the enornous advantage of being true.
WORTH REPEATING
"The truth has the enormous advantage of being true."
Is anyone interested in transcribing and translating this?
Is there ever likely to be a transcription or translated transcription of this?
An example of 9/11 being seriously treated by the French newsmedia would start to make the English newsmedia look just like the joke that it is.
I know someone who will be watching this and just may be willing to transcribe and translate some of this.
However, the task of doing it all is likely to be just too much.
http://candobetter.org/911truth
We need a subtitled DVD or GoogleVideo version ASAP
What we need is a subtitled version of this whole program ready for YouTube etc. consumption as quickly as possible.
But the people know that Oceania can do no wrong!
'An example of 9/11 being seriously treated by the French newsmedia would start to make the English newsmedia look just like the joke that it is.'
Unfortunately, people not already cued into what a joke news media in the English-speaking countries are will buy into the inevitable spin (should such news outlets mention this debate at all) that it is merely an expression of reflexive French anti-Americanism--nothing for us righteous residents of Oceania to trouble our heads about at all.
I recall how, back about 2006, Newsweek magazine at one point had to acknowledge the spread of skepticism toward the 9/11 official story, and they saw fit to inform their readers that this was an idea 'born in France,' or something to that effect--trying to make it sound as though it all started with Thierry Meyssan.
How abut prodcasting program live internationally using webcam
John A MITCHELL
Herblay FRANCE,
bonjour ,
as this programme interest so much the world how about Vers-La Verité or reopen911.info asking Guillaume Durand that they can do a live English translation for the internet ? Technically I think this has been done before in America. Would Guillaume Durand allow his programme to be prodcast live in English world wide via a net webcam ?
Even if he does not agree, nothing stops reopen911.info from having a webcam pointed on the television screen during the programme and retransmitting via the internet with a translation voice added to the image. Even the Germans, Russians could use the image and add thier own translations.
Hey, the "L'Objet Du Scandale" the 28th could be the world's first international citizen's live broadcast on a very important subjet !
I have never yet done a webcam exchange but I think there is a internet exchange protocol like syke ?.
Will be back on the idea at my midday break. Have to catch my train.
Yours
John
Brilliant
You can make it happen I am sure.
using internet/webcam/skype can it be on live internationally?
In France it is skype
http://www.skype.com/intl/fr/
http://www.skype.com/intl/en/
The idea is to zoom the webcam on the télévision with the volume down and the translator listening to the programme on auxiliary headphones.
He translates into the webcam microphone and the all is send by skype or other system to ALEX JONES who does the diffusion by his high powered web site. Perhaps there are web organisateurs who have the means to distrubute the internet programme to thousands in the World.
Perhaps France 2 would accept to participate with the internet and do it directly from their studios ??
some thoughts :
1) le programme is very late ! 22h15 to 00h20
2) if it is transmitted on the internet with decaled time it gives us more time to do a better job in the translation and the viewers will see it at a more reasonable hour.
3) it is true that on direct creates a different dynamic.
4) in the countries which are French-Speaking ( no translations necessary) how interesting would it be to view the programme in a group inorder to capture live the on the spot reactions from one country to another ?
5) can we by using the internet / webcam / skype allow this program to be on live internationnaly ? With reactions taken from many countries ? A sort of International conference run by then layman citizen.
HELP ALEX JONES you have the expertise here ! Who else perhaps reopen911.info also ?
Yours John
PS if it will not be this time I am hoping for the next
Can we
..get this in english?
depends on us all to find the different solutions
depends on us all to find the different solutions
Translation of re-broadcast
I am very much in favour of a subtitled version (or even a simultaneous translation). I have a friend in France who will record it and I might be able to post a download link on the same night. Check this page, I will announce it here.
For your information, a similar format broadcast was aired in Germany in 2003 (story here), . I suspect the debate will be much more even-handed on french TV, not least because it happens 6 years later.
Any news on how this went
Any news on how this went over?
Bigard and Kassovitz set up by interviewers
I just spoke with the author of the article mentioned in another post.
She said that the inteviewers treated Jean-Marie Bigard and Mathieu Kassovitz badly. No actual defenders of the Official 9/11 Conspiracty Theory showed up and the interviewers took on that role instead. Much of the show seemed to consist of questionable films that has been depicted as coming from the mainstream of the 9/11 Truth Movement and the interviewrs attacking those films.
To this Bigard demanded that they debate them and not old films.
Much was made of the differing views within the 9/11 Truth Movement about whether or not planes hit the Penatagon.
Although Niels Harrit, who I understood co-wrote the paper on Nano-Thermite with Dr Steven Jones, was uninvited for reasons that are not clear, the interviewers, nevertheless, spent much time attacking the Nano-thermite paper. I think, at one, point they claimed that the dust samples were collected in 2006 and not on 11 September 2001!
Bigard and Kassowitz, not being experts on the nano-thermite, made their objections to this apparent dirty trick known.
At the end most of the audience seemed to side with Bigard and Kassovitz and made ther objectios to the unfair treatment of Bigard and Kassovitz known.
Sadly, this seems not to have been the big showdown between the 9/11 Truth Movement and defenders of the Official account of 9/11 we hoped that it would be, so the French media seems not altogether free of influences working to suppress the truth.
I will let people know when that article on our blog site becomes available in English.
http://candobetter.org/911truth
Story about debate written in French on normally English site
One of our bloggers wrote of this in French on our web site in the story "Bigard et Kassovitz avec Bonnaud et Gettegno sur l’Objet du Scandale" of 31 Oct 09.
http://candobetter.org/911truth
Link to the "Le Parisien" article, commentaires(~450) on program
John A MITCHELL
Herblay FRANCE
bonjour ,
thank you for the link to the article which is especially usedful for those who have not seen or heard the debate.
In the following link you have what was written in the French popular national newspaper Le Parisien and commentaires ( for the moment in French) on the program
. http://www.911blogger.com/node/21703#comment-220541
I saw no article in the "Libération" and for the moment I have not checked up on the other nationale newspapers.
Have made up a backup video copy of the programme and reviewed it. I think that there is material here to go further. Up to us to translate into english !
Yours John
Found a lot of new very interesting material. A beginning ...
John A MITCHELL
Herblay FRANCE
bonsoir ,
as a Scotsman who became a Frenchman living in France, I have had to adjust my British view on the world with the French one. The history, geopolitiques, ... of the world is very different on key aspects when given by the British TV or French TV.
In the same way I think the emission above on the 28 October 2009 and the other on the 30 th September 2009 which were made for French consommation, will open up the Americain's eyes on how their own TV networks have wrongly shown the 911 truth movement in France and how our French TV is distorting the situation in the States.
Some very intersting material never yet seen on 911blogger and now that France 2 has taken sides, we can now ask them to justify their position and it is perhaps a real 911 start for us in France.
Sorry that this material is not in english and perhaps someone will make an effort to translate the important bits.
Yours
John
Excellent critic of the emission ( 28 October 2009 ) at
Excellent critique de l'émission ( 28 October 2009 ) à
. http://mai68.org/spip/spip.php?article537
.
=== >>> === >>> === >>> === >>> === >>> === >>> === >>> === >>>
The emission of the 30 sept 2009 ( one month ago) on the same programme is also absolutely to be viewed. If we can answer the questions raised here, we will be able to take another big step forward in our struggle for the truth.
. http://mai68.org/spip/spip.php?article446
.
9/11 : L’objet du scandale
Les théories conspirationnistes autour des événements du 11 septembre 2001 étaient l’un des trois sujets de l’émission de Guillaume Durand : « l’objet du scandale » diffusée le 30 septembre 2009 sur France 2. Face aux doutes émis par certaines célébrités, « de Sharon Stone à Jean-Marie Bigard et de Mathieu Kassovitch à David Lynch (...) », en passant par Marion Cotillard, Charlie Sheen... Et surtout face l’ampleur mondiale de la diffusion des idées de la théorie du complot gouvernemental, Guillaume Durand a cru bon de revenir en direct sur le plus gros buzz du net...
Petite synthèse de la seconde partie de l’émission consacrée à ce sujet :
. http://www.agoravox.fr/tribune-libre/article/9-11-l-objet-du-scandale-62483
.
L'Objet du scandale - 11 Septembre 2001 (1)
envoyé par CyberPeople. - L'info video en direct.
.
L'Objet du scandale - 11 Septembre 2001 (2)
envoyé par CyberPeople. - L'info internationale vidéo.
.
L'Objet du scandale - 11 Septembre 2001 (3)
envoyé par CyberPeople. - L'actualité du moment en vidéo.
=== >>> === >>> === >>> === >>> === >>> === >>> === >>> === >>>
.
Aujourd'hui, Jean-Marie Bigard affirme qu'il a été piégé par France 2."Il n'y a pas eu de débat. On nous a tendu un piège. Au début de l'émission, Guillaume Durand débute l'émission par: Si on ne vous a pas tué d'ici la fin de l'émission, nous allons passer pour des mal pensants.
http://www.actu24.be/MBO_Article/364463.aspx
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11 Septembre : l’émission qui rallume la polémique
http://www.leparisien.fr/loisirs-et-spectacles/11-septembre-l-emission-q...
http://forums.france2.fr/france2/L-objet-du-scandale/septembre-polemique...
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Jean-Marie Bigard : France 2 "nous a tendu un piège"
Publié par Julien Lalande
Jeudi 29 Octobre 2009 15h42
http://www.ozap.com/actu/jean-marie-bigard-france2-11-septembre-debat/30...
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Jean-Marie Bigard en colère contre France 2 !
http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:zQJst7sh_IoJ:www.youhumour.com/news...
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Guillaume Durand : du scandale au débat (ou l’inverse ?)
http://www.agoravox.fr/actualites/medias/article/guillaume-durand-du-sca...
English language version now published
The English language version of the article, "French comic J-M Bigard and Mattieu Kassovitz challenge Official 9/11 story on French Television", has now been published.
http://candobetter.org/911truth