If you have time could you please set up something for this story at the "digg it" website?
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
Thanks, and got you setup. Just figured out how to put that neat counter on the entries, so now we can see how many diggs we have.. Thanks again!
FYI, the Kucinich thread got ~50 diggs, but was burried by others, so it never made it to the front page.. So everyone needs to chip in and digg these things!
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
jeez.. i just checked the digg.com wtc7 thread from this morning.. it got 40+ diggs, but was buried as well.. it looks like 2 threads now that would have made digg top pages got 'buried' and hidden.. hrm.
Also, does it matter if links to stories at digg.com are clicked on here? Someone posted here a while ago saying that it lessons the story's chance of reaching the top pages. Whether or not that's true I dunno.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
are crawling all over that website burying 9/11 truth.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
And the government apologists are gonna still be in denial, cowering in fear of Al Queda and bowing to their masters while we fight the new revolution.
The bombshells continue to drop. The official story is being incinerated daily.
What kind of "conspiracy theory" GROWS exponentially each year?
We're winning! Keep it up!
Send an e-mail to the ABC television network through their online e-mail form saying that you're glad the subject of 9/11 is being discussed on the show. Do it now. It's imperative that they get positive feedback about the subject being discussed on the air!
from the resistance manifesto website...
"A dark web of evil is exposed like never before, making Bible Prophecy and the New World Order crystal clear. Learn the most powerful information on the 9/11 inside job, plans for the rise of the Antichrist, the institutions, people, and powers involved, and how you can fight them."
yeah, great endorsement for the truth. let's see, we have, on his homepage, talk of prophecies, cults, the antichrist, end times, satanic secret societies, etc., but no talk or understanding of geopolitics, apartheid, war crimes, or anything relevant. this guy is a deranged kook, plain and simple. i wouldn't be the least bit surprised if he was a controlled asset, either.
I can't believe Rosie actually said the words "9/11 was an inside job" and then they responded with "well look into it for yourself everyone".
To me, this sort of media permissiveness of 9/11 might be an indication that there will be an effort to try to co-opt the truth of 9/11, make into an exclusively anti-Bush/neo-con movement and justify increased globalism and foreign intervention.
Whatever your politics are, 9/11 involved more than one narrow group of ideologues, and the complicity goes way back to the Carter administration and even further when you look at the muslim brotherhood, etc.
Let's embrace the exposure but stay on message with provable facts and not allow the truth to be coopted for political aims.
I think this is part of the roll out of the inevitable limited hangout we know will be put forward.
Additionally, this steers those watching "The View" to a less than ideal website insuring that their first impression of 9/11 Truth will be that it is promoted by kooks. It is too little, too late, imo.
The truth shall set us free. Love is the only way forward.
i guess with some people every silver cloud has a dark lining.
this is tremendous. opinions are like assholes - everyone has one.
ya know - the one thing consistent i've learned over the years is that the phrase "limited hangout" is a sure-fire way of squashing legitimate avenues of inquiry.
oh - don't recommend "Press for the Truth" because its limited hangout.
oh - Albanese's film is limited hangout.
oh - don't ever talk about the alleged hijackers because that's limited hangout.
oh - don't ever say a plane hit the Pentagon beause that's limited hangout.
I've been hearing this phrase since 2003 and its tired. 4 years ago the 9/11 truth movement was a handfull of people nationwide - and the media would not even whisper a HINT of the subject. there was a 100% air-tight media black out on the subject.
now, MILLIONS are tuned in and demanding answers. it is frankly LAUGHABLE to suggest that all of this attention is a grand plot to herd us into a "limited hangout" holding pen.
PUH-LEEZE!
either do something positive for this movement - or take your sour grapes to Nico Haupt's website where you can accuse everyone and every line of legitimate research and every postive development a 'limited hangout.'
you see - the truth is not located in anyone place. you will not find teh truth in Loose Change or in Alex Jones. You will not find the truth in my film. You will not find the truth at 911Truth.org.
But - public awareness continues to carry the movement - as a whole - forward. Less than idea websites won't deter people from seeing past the imperfections and coming to understand that 911 truth is a phenomenon - FOR A REASON.
i STARTED in this movement as a Pentagon theorist. i now REJECT the no-planes theories. but - the pentagon opened pandora's box for me. for others it was Loose Change - another highly problematic source.
we may not be able to find the truth in any one place - but this movement is sustained by the fact that government LIES and COVERUPS and COINCIDENCES are everywhere.
99% of the View's audience will not even go to the website. all they know is that they heard Rosie and Brolin BOTH say on national television that 911 was an inside job.
Fans of Rosie are just as committed as those to Oprah.... they are smarter that we seem to be giving them credit.
___________________
Ignorance is NOT Bliss
(what is a "panacea of information" anyway? We've got an answer for everything?)
I think that Rosie's plug got in under the radar since it was ambiguous - like the South Park episode. But still, it's millions of dollars of publicity.
Yet I don't think it will lead to any break, through the Media trance our country is held in. More smelling salts are needed for that job than a one minute sound bite.
And I think we as activists shouldn't be afraid of speaking out the truth as was see it - as does John Connor, without concern for possible disapproval or censure.
John Connor wants to tell people. He wont shirk his responsibility even if it gets him arrested. So he's a Christian? - that's speaks well of Christians IMO. That's how the religion grew - people not afraid to say what they believed to others and shout it out if necessary.
If our own "activists" are either afraid to say what they truly believe for fear what others will think, or are in actuality merely observers of the "cultural scene" of the 9/11 Truth activists, it all boils down to the same thing: Limited Hangout.
And no wonder Albanese is allergic to that term!?
Either way we would do well to learn from the example of O'Donnell, who has a reputation as a big mouth but not a fake.
If you carefully read what i wrote you'll see that my "limited hangout" is clearly being applied to the msm represented by "The View". Do you think that this plug for John Connor was an accident?
I simply do not trust ANYTHING that comes out in the msm like this and look for the subtext. The perps are clearly very concerned and are desperately trying to come up with a limited hangout option they think they can sell. It won't work, too much is known by too many already.
I have never, nor will ever, attempt to squash anyone's avenue of inquiry.
I also think you need to calm down a bit (decaf?) and not immediately jump to conclusions and be so accusatory. Why the hysterics? Is it that you see red when you see the phrase "limited hangout"?
Please read my post on this subject on another thread.
I have shown 9/11 Press for Truth to many people, it is the first dvd I offer to people who are completely unaware of 9/11 Truth or who are highly resistant for whatever reason. I have had extraordinary success showing people this excellent film and am working with the producers to get it into theaters all over northern California.
I recently attended the Media Reform conference in Memphis where we sold many copies of PFT. At this same conference I personally put a copy of PFT, along with other materials, into Phil Donohue's hands and told him that if he watched the first 5 minutes of PFT that he would want to watch it to the end.
Mr. Albanese, you strike me as a very intelligent person, however, continued knee-jerk reactions like this will only cause people to lose respect for you and damage your credibility.
Perhaps we can hit each other with creme pies simultaneously. Please make mine a chocolate creme pie.
I hope that you and yours are well.
The truth shall set us free. Love is the only way forward.
I am slightly bemused by the posts in this thread by John Albanese, as I had thought he was of above average intelligence. Now I am rethinking that position.
I would like to drive home the point that John Conner is a FAKE.
It is just so bloody obvious.
I already posted a more thoughtful comment about this in the thread, and I also attempted to post it to my blog on 911Blogger but it has mysteriously failed to appear.
What has happened to the smart people on this website? Its very disappointing to see you all supporting this nonsense.
I've always found Conner's style a bit of a turn-off, similar to Alex Jones. It makes every skeptic look like a madman.
I still think it was just a GCN plug.
Guys like Jones and Conner don't offer solutions, they just rely on fear-mongering and shouting in what I see as an attempt to create a fanbase who will buy and promote their works, similar to Howard Stern's "shockvalue" of the 90s.
But what do I know...
///////////////////// 911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
I have watched his bullhorn antics which were posted here a while back. At that time I thought he seemed like an amusing if a little socially inept activist.
But now that I've seen his lurid website I defintely smell a rat. This guy ain't what he seems to be folks. Why do you think he goes out of his way to smear Hunter S. Thompson, who was, as we know, trying to expose 9/11 just before he was "suicided"?
I don't believe he believes that bullsh*t about the antichrist - it's just a disinfo tactic, like all the others.
Why don't you believe that he believes there will be an anti-christ? Many, many people believe that and I am one of them. Being a Christian means that you believe the Bible is literal and that there is a God, that Jesus died on the cross for our sins and that includes the book of Revelation. This has nothing, I repeat nothing at all to do with disinfo in any way.
John Conner is real and he truly believes in God.
How does he go "out of his way to smear Hunter S. Thompson"? He didn't himself make up, what he says on his site, about Thompson. He put it on his site based off of the investifation conducted by former Senator John DeCamp and former head of the L.A. FBI Ted Gunderson. Their investigation produced witnesses to this. One was a photographer and one was a victim (Paul Bonacci) of the CIA's child sex/kidnapping/satanic ritual sacrifice ring who said that Thompson produced the snuff films.
I wouldn't hide information like that about one of the "alleged" participants just because he was involved in exposing 9/11 as an inside job.
Good question. I've wondered the same thing in the past. Recently I've come to realize that it does talk about dinosaurs in the Bible.
Since you asked...
The Bible uses ancient names like "behemoth" and "tannin." Behemoth means kingly, gigantic beasts. Tannin is a term which includes dragon-like animals and the great sea creatures such as whales, giant squids, and marine reptiles like the plesiosaurs that may have become extinct.
God has revealed to us the major events of history from the beginning of time to enable us to build a way of thinking to understand the universe.
When one accepts the history timeline as outlined in Scripture, it is easy to explain dinosaurs. When one understands that land animals (including dinosaurs) were made on the sixth day of creation—that there was no death (of animals or man) or disease (there are dinosaur bones that show evidence of diseases like cancer) before sin—that all the land animal kinds (including dinosaurs) were on the Ark—and that many animal groups (including dinosaurs) have died out since the Flood (because sin, the curse, and the Flood affected the world)—then it’s easy to explain the history of dinosaurs.
Also, there is a lot of evidence (such as carvings and paintings of dinosaur-like creatures)—and (unfossilized) dinosaur bone with red blood cells—that makes sense in the light of the biblical account of history. Did you know that a dinosaur may be described in detail in the Bible? Check out Job 40:15–19. And if the notes in your Bible state that this animal was an elephant or hippo, read the passage again to see that this can’t be so.
Did you know the word “dinosaur” was first invented in 1841? Dinosaurs were probably called “dragons” before that time. And the Hebrew word for “dragon” is used a number of times in the Old Testament. There are also dragon legends prevalent in cultures around the world. It’s possible these are accounts of encounters with beasts we today call dinosaurs.
The reason many Christians have been unable to give answers about dinosaurs is because they have tried to “fit” them into the Bible—instead of using the Bible and its true account of history to explain them. This is done in detail in my book The Great Dinosaur Mystery Solved.
DHS, by the way, man, thanks for the DVDs. I appreciate it.
"Did you know that a dinosaur may be described in detail in the Bible? Check out Job 40:15–19. And if the notes in your Bible state that this animal was an elephant or hippo, read the passage again to see that this can’t be so."
Actually, I copied and pasted that because I wanted to quickly answer his question. The part you pointed out was just one small part of what I posted. I gave historical and factual information in relation to the other parts.
I'm not going to discuss dinosaurs in the Bible in this thread. I could really get into this, but this is not the place. I believe the Bible is the Word of God and I am a Christian. I've spent all of my life studying the Bible and trying to be a better person and a better Christian. I believe it with everything that I am so I'll just leave it at that.
I know plenty of Christians who DO NOT believe the Bible is literal. You have to know this. I'd even bet that MOST don't believe the Bible is literal. Unless you're prepared to stone people for disobeying their parents.
I will respect your beliefs, but please stop talking out your arse.
I know that many Christians do not believe it's literal, but if that's the case, does that mean the Bible is not the Word of God? If that's the case, then what is a Christian? Someone who believes in a figurative Jesus or someone who believes Jesus was real, but the Bible is not the Word of God? This is a very conflicting issue with many sides.
The Bible doesn't teach that you should be stoned for your sins or stone someone else for their sins. This was in the Old Testament and these things are an account of happened then. That is the old covenant. After Jesus died, that covenant was broken. So, the old laws from the Old Testament, such as only wearing certain types of clothing and things like that, were done away with.
of Christians which is about 20% of the USA are Fundamentalist nut jobs that take the Bible as literal.
That is about 60 Million delusional psychotics in this country.
True, very scary--but as you point out this is only 1/5 of Christians in the states. MOST Christians are tolerant reasonable people(like MOST people).
The problem is Jason's definition of a "Christian" is ludicrously narrow. Basically he's saying Fundamentalists are the ONLY Christians. It is that sort of arrogant mentality that led to Protestants and Cathlolics burning each other in the 16th-17th centuries.
understand where he is coming from and technically he is correct.
35+% is over 1/3 BTW not 1/5.
Its about 1/5 the whole population, but only about 71-73% of the population claim to be Christian today, down from the 86% in 1990.
I believe what he is getting at is that you are a Christian by name only unless you are Fundy nut job.
and if you look at it using the very same dogma that all Christians claim they follow then that book gives fairly precise actions & beliefs one must adhere to in order to be a Christian.
There is no way possible to follow the vast majority of the lunacy in the bible without treating it as 100% infallible and literal.
In that respect he is correct.
Also that "arrogant mentality" is almost always inflicted onto one religious group towards another religious group based solely on how each group "interprets" their chosen dogma.
Protestants Vs Catholics, Muslims Vs Christians and so on.
It boils down to some just completely leaving their brains at the church doorstep and deciding to deny factual reality at all cost no matter how irrefutable (Fundy's) Vs those that are still trying to pick and chose what they want to believe because so much of any given religious dogma is utterly insane they try and work around it by simply choosing a few points they like and making excuses about the rest.
Such as making an excuse about not having to adhere to Old Testament doctrines when in fact without the OT doctrine the NT is completely moot.
For instance if you don't follow/believe Genesis then how could you possibly be a Christian?
Either the mythical Christian sun god created the Earth, all life, trillions of stars and the void in between with a wave of his magic wand just a few 1000 years ago or he didn't.
All of the main tenets of Christianity are found in the OT so to dismiss it as no longer valid because of the NT is dishonest at best.
Agree that the "NT" clause--how it's used is dishonest.
What we have a case of here is not distinguishing between inspired spirituallity and religous dogma. Fundamentalists believe dogma IS religion/spirituality--if I follow these pavlovian contradictory rules I will be saved--from something. Everybody else, including Chriustians who are not Fundies, use religion/myth/philosophy/common sense to inspire themselves to be better people--and if someone way back in ANY testament got it wrong, that bit has got to GO.
I am worried that ANYONE is trained to think moral judgment is found in a book that cannot be questioned. Moral people of ALL creeds know ultimate moral responsibility for your actions is yours alone--the Bible made me do it DOES NOT cut it.
Sadly a huge chunk of the American public are delusional psychotics that get their moral compass from a book written by nobody knows whom about 1900 years ago that was largely copied from much older Paganism from Sumeria, Babylon, Kemet , who's origin was around 2000BCE.
Bronze age morals of what amounts to savages of which blood sacrifice, slavery, killing people that merely broke a simple religious law such as, picking up fire wood to keep warm with on the Sabbath and other such triviality was considered socially acceptable & morally correct.
To believe this tripe I can only come to the conclusion that they must be insane and should be treated as such, religious loons need our pity & help, they need psychotherapy & heavy medication.
Unfortunately because of mass delusion & political correctness those of us not insane can not even touch upon this subject as the moniker of religion acts as a shield protecting those that have lost all concept of factual reality.
They become immune to mental evaluation hiding behind Religion.
Paraphrasing Sam Harris a bit, I think most people would agree that you would have to be a complete lunatic to be certain of Poseidon, for instance. If someone was going to run a political campaign and as part of their stump speech they said these hurricanes in the Gulf have become an increasing concern, and we have to start praying to Poseidon, the god who deals with the ocean. This is a crazy thing to say. Everyone would recoil, it would be the end of that person's political career immediately right on the spot, and yet we are talking as though there was some epistemological difference between talking about Poseidon and talking about the God of Abraham, and there isn't except for the number of fools that believe it.
If this same politician simply came out and said he was an Atheist he would get the same treatment and his political career is over and probably get a few death threats while hes at it from all those fine moral Christians.
Yet if this same politician said we must "pray to god" (meaning the christian sun god of course) to stop these hurricanes then that is just fine as a matter of fact it would expected of him to say something that ridiculous.
In the case of King George the W he has actually said that he personally talks to his little invisible friend and that is whom told him to attack Iraq.
In a world not run by delusional psychotics such a statement should assure him of a week or 2 in an asylum with mandatory weekly treatments & medications.
Instead such a statement gets him high praise from about 70% of the population.
Somehow this has got to change or we are in the fast lane towards extinction as a species.
"To believe this tripe I can only come to the conclusion that they must be insane and should be treated as such, religious loons need our pity & help, they need psychotherapy & heavy medication.
Unfortunately because of mass delusion & political correctness those of us not insane can not even touch upon this subject as the moniker of religion acts as a shield protecting those that have lost all concept of factual reality.
They become immune to mental evaluation hiding behind Religion."
Wow...that's an extremely delusional and baseless statement. My mental stability is perfectly fine. I'm a very smart, intelligent, logical, thoughtful, caring person. Psychology has been something that has fascinated me since I was 10 years old. At that age, I started studying human thought and emotional behaviour. The human mind and individuals thought processes have always fascinated me. I've "profiled" probably every person I've ever encountered since that time. So, trust me, I know how mentally unstable people are. I know better than almost amyone how people think and how "crazy" and deluded "people" are. I am not one of them.
I am far from perfect, but how dare you imply that I am "insane and should be treated as such, religious loons need our pity & help, they need psychotherapy & heavy medication"? C'mon, now, even I see that as a very extreme assumption.
Anyone can become a Christian. You can't lump all Christians together just as you can't lump any "group" of people together.
"You can't lump all Christians together just as you can't lump any "group" of people together."
That was part of OUR point when YOU implied to be a Christian one had to believe the Bible was the literal word of God--as opposed to the words of humans inspired by their sincere beliefs.
So if anyone is having trouble seeing the diversity of your own religon, that's YOU, sunshine.
I know the extreme range of diversity better than anyone. I don't know what you're saying. I think I've made it clear that I see the diversity.
This topic shouldn't even be one that divides us or one that is discussed here. I love you guys and I'm very thankful for all of you. I don't want our belief in God to seperate us. Beliefs in holograms I can see, but not this.
"In the case of King George the W he has actually said that he personally talks to his little invisible friend and that is whom told him to attack Iraq."
Bush is not a Christian and the same for H.W. Bush. W. Bush studies the Talmud. It has nothing do to with the Bible. H.W. passed into law the "Seven Noahide Laws" that will make it legal to kill Christians when the time comes they feel that this is necessary. The "Seven Noahide Laws" are satanic, anti-Christian and come from the Talmud. This ties in directly with Bible prophesy in the end times when Christians will be killed for stating that they believe in Jesus Christ. Why would a "Christian" man pass these "Noahide Laws" into law? They wouldn't.
When Bush said he was "fulfilling the Ancient Hope of the New Order of the Ages", he was not talking about anything to do with Christianity. This is something that's rooted in the occult.
These men, along with many other world "leaders" worship an ancient "secret" occult teaching. They also worship the owl god "Molech" at a ceremony performed at the Bohemian Grove and they've been involved in satanic and occult practices while members of the group Skull and Bones and other "secret societies". It's documented and it is occult and satanic. It has nothing to do with Christianity or believing in, trusting and knowing Christ in any way. They are the exact opposite. I don't know what voice Bush was hearing, but it wasn't Jesus Christ.
Jenny, I do not get my moral compass from the Bible.
I am not a "psychotic nut job". My morals come from the everything that I've experienced and from putting things together and looking at all sides of every situation. It just so happens that for me, my morals and the was I see things are the same as the things that Jesus Christ taught.
I believe that Jesus died on the cross for the sins of every person and that the Bible is the Word of God. One day, everyone will find out for themselves. Until then, I will continue to serve Jesus Christ, help everyone that I can, help to expose the lies and deceptions of this world, educate myself on what's going on in the world and help to bring down the new world order. I will do all of this with the love of Jesus Christ in my heart. That is who I am.
"Such as making an excuse about not having to adhere to Old Testament doctrines when in fact without the OT doctrine the NT is completely moot.
For instance if you don't follow/believe Genesis then how could you possibly be a Christian?
Either the mythical Christian sun god created the Earth, all life, trillions of stars and the void in between with a wave of his magic wand just a few 1000 years ago or he didn't.
All of the main tenets of Christianity are found in the OT so to dismiss it as no longer valid because of the NT is dishonest at best."
It's not an "excuse". Christians are simply not required to follow the Old Testament laws because Jesus died on the cross for our sins. The Bible is divided into the Old Testament and the New Testament for a reason. The Old Testament is the old covenant. After Jesus died on the cross, that covernant was broken. The New Testament is the new covenant because Christ took our sins and that includes the old laws of the Old Testament. It's not an excuse. It's the way that it is.
There is a huge difference in "believing" and "following" the Old Testament. They are two completely different things. I know that many people do not understand the difference between the Old and the New Testamnets and that people still think the Bible teaches what is recorded in the Old Testament, but anyone who studies this knows the difference.
So if there was never the Crucifiction you would feel obligated to follow all the Old Testament laws of the ancient Hebrews? Just so we're clear, this includes killing your children if they talk back; sacking/ raping/pillaging your enemies because you think God told you to; justifying incest?
Have you actually READ the Old Testament? And the only thing keeping you from justifiying all this rubbish is because "someone was nailed to a tree for saying how good it would be to be nice to each other for a change"(Douglas Adams interpretation)? Do you understand that sounds like a very tenuous basis to trust you have internalized adult ethics?
People didn't discover ethics at the Crucifiction. All the crap in the OT, ON BOTH SIDES, was instigated by the same ruling class bastards who are the spiritual ancestors of the ones we're fighting. Believe what you want--that is your right, but if you need the Crucifiction to make it clear much of that OT rubbish was EVIL(again, on BOTH sides) one has to wonder whether you have the moral courage to challenge authority and power effectively.
I believe that man was the Son of God (God in the flesh).
Yes, I have read it. Not every word, but a lot of it and I studied it in school, church and Bible study.
"but if you need the Crucifiction to make it clear much of that OT rubbish was EVIL(again, on BOTH sides) one has to wonder whether you have the moral courage to challenge authority and power effectively."
No, I would not think it's right. I don't think what they did in the Old Testamnet was right, but that's all gone now and we don't have to follow those laws. The New Testament is about what it means to be a Christian. We are not ruled by those old laws.
I have all of the "moral courage to challenge authority" there is in the world and I still have room for more. I can't see anyone understanding that more than I do.
They NEVER should have had to follow those laws. The only reason they did was the religous militaristic bastards of the time would kill you if you didn't.
And I'm not picking on the Hebrews. The Pharohs did this, so did the Romans(though they cared less about religous compliance, than civil obediance), so did anyone who was willing to kill to get and maintain power. This was NEVER okay. And all good people, of all creeds, in all times, knew it.
"The problem is Jason's definition of a "Christian" is ludicrously narrow. Basically he's saying Fundamentalists are the ONLY Christians."
I can't say that anything other than that is wrong because obviously, I do not know that part for a fact. I hope that makes sense. I'm just saying that if a person doesn't believe the Bible is the Word of God, then that can make the definition of a Christian mean a lot of things.
The Bible teaches nothing but God's love and how to live a life that is based on that faith and love. If someone does not believe the Bible to be literal then what does a person believe exactly? Are they really Christians in God's eyes? I can't say they're not, but I believe that God could see otherwise based on what I've read and heard other people discuss, but obviously I don't know that for a fact. That's all I'm saying.
is the most vile, hate filled, disgusting book ever written.
To claim all it "teaches is gods love" shows how far gone you really are.
I would suggest to seek therapy.
Just FYI it is impossible to be a true Christian in accordance with the bible.
To say that it is vile and disgusting and that it teaches bad things shows that you have absoluetly no idea what you are talking about.
To suggest I need therapy and that every Christian is crazy, needs therapy and needs to be medicated is what sounds a little "crazy", if nothing else it's frightening how you think so badly about it. I can promise you that Chritianity is truly about faith and love and nothing else. Individuals are the ones who have used Christianity and the name of the Lord to "justify", in their minds, doing terrible things throughout history and things like that have happened in the name of many different things, including different religions and even various groups and organizations.
Also, just because someone is a Christian does not mean that they instantly become better people. We are still regular people like everyone else and people are flawed and weak. People do terrible things. Just because a "Christian" might do something bad, it does not mean it's because that's what they were taught to do.
It sounds like you have a some very deep problems with Christians.
You have said what you wanted to say on the subject. Why can't you two just drop it?
Actually I had--until you tried to claim the Christian diversity "high ground" that was MY initial point(Christian diversity--not high ground). Wasn't going to let you slide on that one, chum.
your opinion/reaction to Vol. 2 of 9/11 and American Empire, especially Catherine Keller's chapter. I find her take on Christianity to be spot on (for me), especially regarding our deeper motivations for pursuing 9/11 Truth. Makes my soul smile. Yow!
I'm only about 1/3 through the book, but I highly recommend it.
I hope that you and yours are well.
The truth shall set us free. Love is the only way forward.
when I want.
Yes I have problems with religious fanatics, fundamentalist nut jobs.
I have problems with people that are clearly insane but because of the moniker of religion they are protected from ridicule & the law.
How many times have we all seen some Fundy nut do something completely insane, whether its stoning their children to death or in the case of Hitler murdering 6 Million people and first thing you hear is oh "hes not a true Christian".
Bullshit, it is precisely "true Christians" that are the most insane and more likely to do something completely crazy.
This is the 21st century, as human beings we should be working to get past the pre dark ages mentality of religious dogma.
Belief in mythical sun gods, magic should not be prevalent in a civilized society in the 21st century.
There is no excuse in this day & age to believe such nonsense.
"“Good people will do good things, and bad people will do bad things. But for good people to do bad things that takes religion.” Stephen Weinberg
You have no idea what you are saying. You are taking this really personal, for some reason.
It is not "true Christians" who do the terrible things like the ones that you used as examples. You could not be further from the meaning of a true Christian. Those things are not taught by Jesus Christ or any true Christian. There is no violence, hate or cruelty in true Christianity. There is only love.
I know that many people have done terrible things in the name of Christianity throughout history, but those are the people that you speak of. They're probably not even .001 percent of all Christians. Every "group" of people have people who are mentally unstable who twist and distort things for their own agenda, but that does not mean that Christians and Christianity are the definitions of the things that you describe.
I don't believe in religion or mythical sun gods. I don't believe that people should practice magic of any kind.
You seem to not only "dislike" Christians. It seems that you hate them. One thing I can promise you is that this "hate" or whatever you call it, is a negative thing. I hope you can overcome these feelings and see Christianity for what it is...it's about believing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, giving your life to Him, accepting forgiveness, learning what it is to truly love and learning to let go and get rid of the sins that we were set free from. It's about learning to love, accept and forgive. How many people actually do this who call themselves Christians? Well, it seems like a small amount, sometimes, but anyone can call themselves anything. It doesn't mean anything until a person learns to live it.
You don't believe in religon? What do you think Christianity is?
And you seem to be as uniformed about magic as you believe Nunaybiz is about Christianity. I say this as a Pagan/Wiccan---but note I NEVER put the practices of historical pagans before my own moral judgment. Most historical Pagans were good people; most historical Christians were good people.
I entirely agree with your point that in any group you will have a small percent who go bad--though .001 is probably too low. I'd say it's more like .01--say the same amount that owns most of the wealth currently? The problem--historically and currently--is that some of these people have so much power, they have a disportionate influence on the rest of the population. When people are manipulated by this group they can be capaple of anything--while believing they are a good person: burning witches, raping children, torturing "terrosits suspects".
While Nun. may be over-stating the case, the fact is political Christianity had been responsible for MOST of the bloodshed and wars in western european history. And its effects are still being felt across the globe. And major Christian organizations--the Vatican being the foremost--refuse to take responibility for past actions or even educate their followers about their history so lay people can be there to hold priests accountable when they screw up(I was raised Catholic). So you'll excuse us if we get a little techy if it sounds like someone wants to excuse this authoritarian BEHAVIOR.
I have a lovely neighbor who belongs to a Celtic Christian church who could tell you how this disfunctional rubbish from dualism infected early Christianity, but that's neither here nor there.
Believe what you want--as long as it inspires you to be a good person.
Yeah like I said and you just confirmed, its never "true Christians" that ever do ANYTHING bad, EVER.
You can believe that all you wish, but every Christian claims and believes that they are true Christians.
Christianity has been responsible for most Wars Death, Civil Unrest, Racism, Sexism, Genocide than any other single factor in all of human history.
ANY and all religions that promote a single god, a god that demands obedience and tells its followers that all whom do not believe in me are going straight to hell.
A god that says unbelievers are basically the scum of the Earth and are to be distrusted or killed.
When "Christian Soldiers" get all hoped up on the lord and feel no matter what atrocity they commit is all perfectly justified by Biblical Scripture, then what you have is "good people doing bad things"...They are of course completely delusional, suffering from severe Cognitive Dissonance and Psychosis, they "believe" they are doing good, doing "gods work".
However in factual reality where the rest of us live they are as evil as human beings can possibly be.
"You seem to not only "dislike" Christians. It seems that you hate them"
Not quite, I absolutely HATE with ever fiber of my being "RELIGION" the "Institution of Christianity" etc.
I merely "Pity" Christians themselves for being so easily fooled by fairy tales.
I cant hate someone that has been brainwashed most of their lives to believe in this tripe.
Its not exactly their fault that they are simple minded or too trusting.
"it's about believing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, giving your life to Him, accepting forgiveness, learning what it is to truly love and learning to let go and get rid of the sins that we were set free from."
You see this right here is a completely psychotic statement of which not a single shred of empirical evidence exist to make one believe something so utterly absurd.
Number one there is not a shred of evidence any such person ever existed, Nothing, nil, Nada, zip.
Even if some shred of evidence were to ever come to light that a MAN by the name Jesus of Nazareth existed and even was crucified, the fairytale would end right right there as there is no possible evidence that could ever prove this man was a "son of any god".
So "giving your life" to a mythical sun god is crazy, it is based entirely on belief in a myth that real Archeology has debunked several different ways.
"accepting forgiveness" for what?
For being born a human being? LOL This is so absurd it is really hard for me to believe so many people so easily fall for something so incredibly bizarre.
Allow me to describe this psychosis.
Christianity makes a mockery of the concept of a God. At the same time that Christians claim to worship God as an omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent being, they make him out to be an incompetent bumbling idiot. Or worse. Simple forgiveness is beyond his capacities. God must "sacrifice himself to himself to change a rule he made himself!"
This is not only an absurdity, it is an essential absurdity. It is present in almost all forms of Christianity, and one can scarcely remove it and remain a Christian in anything but name. By definition, all Christians worship Christ - in some form - and most worship him as a savior.
But what, exactly, is he saving them from? Though it varies from church to church, no matter what they call it, it's God himself. A hell created by God, a world fallen as a result of God's negligence, a separation from God imposed...by God. How utterly absurd to worship a so called "Savior" of which what he is saving you from is "himself"! ROTFL
The NT that you keep on spewing from is without any question an "Astrological Drama" that was written in the old Pagan Passion Play style, most of this book was a series of Stage Plays based on Sun Worship.
The characters are allegorical and were never meant to be "historical".
Jesus = The Sun
Mary = Virgo
Joseph= Bootes
John the Baptist = Aquarius the water bearer
The 2 Fisherman = Pisces
and so on.
The whole story is clearly based on a 1 year "ministry" which is allegorical for a 1 year Sun Cycle, the 4 seasons.
I have read the Bible 4 times cover to cover, only on the 3rd time did it make a lick of sense to me once I learned the True Origins of the Bible, when I placed an Astrological Template over it then suddenly everything made sense.
I know, hell I have forgotten more than you know about the Bible. I have researched Christianity & various other religions for 32 years now.
In your state of delusion & Cognitive Dissonance you will of course flatly refuse to accept anything that goes against your "beliefs", that is a pity as there is really no way to have a rational discussion with someone that refuses to accept documented fact in favor of "faith" in something that the evidence proves is non-existent.
Why does this site always dump on Alex Jones?
He's the best truth warrior we got right now!!!
You guys don't like him because he actually GETS UPSET about what is going on and doesn't do so in a gentlemen-like fashion.
I don't think I'd be very gentlemen-like after I PREDICTED 9/11, told people to call the White House about it and no one did anything and people still think he's a nut case.
Alex - you're amazing, keep it up!!
GET MAD!!!
while Jones sells a lot of products he has woken up countless people through his documentaries and website. your whole premise is ridiculous. Alex Jones does a LOT of good work along with selling a lot of stuff. i cant hate the man for wanting to make money as long as he keeps pushing important information. which he does correct? as far as just "fear-mongering" goes, i think thats even more ridiculous. comparing Alex Jones to Howard Stern? wow...........(and i acually dont mind Stern that much, he is what he is, but come on now.) i dont like the style of Alex Jones or Conner as much as i do other researchers and activists, but that doesnt make me blind to the postive things they contribute. the substance is there, even if the style is lacking. just fear mongering? maybe he shouldnt try and help expose 9/11 right? too scary? see my point? the good outweighs the bad, if people are dumb enough to think that Conner and Alex Jones represent ALL 9/11 truth activists then they are fucking morons who are better off staying ignorant anyway.
911oz wrote: "What has happened to the smart people on this website?"
So if people don't agree with you they aren't "smart"?
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
You really believe this teevee show featuring John Conner is setting up a "checkmate"? Now that strikes me as "less than smart". Please elaborate. Because I want to learn more about how this teevee show will bring defeat to the 9/11 truth movement.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
'Strategic advantage' would be a better term. They are always looking for ways to get a strategic advantage, and they have used a variety of disinfo gambits to achieve this, mainly by mixing 9/11 Truth with ideas which lack credibility, such as:
holocaust denial
apollo moon hoax theory
alien reptilian theory
no plane theory
space beam theory
pods
bible prophecy
The question of whether any of these might turn out to be true is irrelevant.
You haven't really paid attention to LeftRight's blogs or posts have you? Because if you had that little snarky "do something positive for the movement" etc, comment wouldn't have gotten typed on your keyboard.
BTW, since you bring up your old "friend", have you ever wondered about his relationship with SLC?
Just because he doesn't go about exposing the truth exactly how you would like it doesn't mean he's a shill or a fake.
He sounds very sincere during interviews and he's actually pretty damn smart.
No, he's not a geopolitical expert but he's got his facts down about 9/11 and he's trying to expose it.
I personally like his methods of confronting people - someone's gotta do it!!!
STOP HATING ON 9/11 TRUTH ACTIVISTS! WE ALL HAVE OUR OWN WAY OF SPREADING TRUTH.
GO OUT THERE AND START YOUR OWN WEBSITE AND BE EVEN BIGGER THAN CONNOR OR ALEX JONES!
I would have thought the same thing a few years ago, but all it takes is a couple books and it becomes clear how the super bankers and the top of the controlled politicians and intelligence agencies are into some seriously skewed stuff. Whatever route you take to it, Bohemian Grove, John DeCamp's book "The Franklin Cover-Up," or even books like Nesta Webster's "Secret Societies and Subversive Movements" (published in 1924!), it becomes quite clear that they're not just psychos, but they're warped humans with a very diabolical plan - and luciferian belief, child sacrifice, and all kinds of sick stuff is without a doubt part of it.
as usual - anyone who has a quicktime or Mpeg version of this - i would be eternally grateful.
when you juxtapose all of the celebrities and highly-regarded researchers who are now stepping forward (almost everyday now) - and compare it against all the gibberish coming out of the cointelpro crowd - the contrast is amazing.
it becomes obvious that the public is waking up - and that the disinformation campaign is getting increasingly arcane and ridiculous by comparison.
its amazing what a non-violent peaceful community can accomplish.
tonight i will be on Visibility 911 with Michael Woolsey from 911truth.org talking about disinformation and cointelpro. i will make sure to hit the holocaust deniers on your behalf.
- Rosie plugged '9/11 was an inside job' TWICE...That was awesome!
- Joy Behar (who supports the patriot movement apparently) showed great interest and started writing down John's website, just like when Brolin plugged 911weknow.com
- The Neo Con fake-blond to the right surprisingly said she would definitely check out John's website and/or youtube posts. She even told Joy Behar to write the website URL down for her.
- I thought the audience was fairly receptive and not immediately dismissive to this info, which is really nice for once. Although, the brief moment of laughter re-assured me that people are doomed to slavery unless they grow up and open their eyes.
- The folks over at Disney/ABC allowed this to go on national broadcast...
*Given this recent plug and others prior to this on this show, Lou Dobbs CNN opposition to the NWO's agenda, Keith Olbermann NBC anti-Neo Con stance , etc. etc.,
Could this mean that some of the Global Elitists are opposing the Neo-Con's and the people that pulled off 9/11? Could this add credibility to the notion that maybe the elite are fighting with eachother in a power struggle??
...just food for thought
that is certain, they're only a bunch of individuals. However, even those that might now begin to oppose the aggressive neocon strategy do so not because they suddenly found their conscience, but because they've become aware that their foundation is shaking and they need to make amends. At least that's what I believe. All of these cynical powermongers intent on misleading and herding us like cattle should be stripped of their power, so that this will be the century of the people!
Totally, I agree....But there's a saying that says "Snakes always end up eating eachother in the end"...
I've also heard the term "Implode" being used when talking about the NWO and how it will ultimately destroy itself when it gets too big...
"Could this mean that some of the Global Elitists are opposing the Neo-Con's and the people that pulled off 9/11? Could this add credibility to the notion that maybe the elite are fighting with eachother in a power struggle??"
Definitely. Don't forget about the recent Brzezinski warning about the possible (likely?) FALSE FLAG ATTACK (he used this laguage) to start a war with Iran. Brzezinski is clearly in league with the Global Elitists, but me thinks that there is disension within different factions. Some must see the writing on the wall, that the Neo-Con power grab in the middle east (triggered by 911) and promising to escalate into Iran, is a disaster for ALL (including many of the Power-Mongers who are happy to steal and cheat in more delicate ways). The dark forces are falling apart. Keep shining the light people.
I can almost smell in the air another 9/11 or Pearl Harbor type event waiting to happen any week now...Dammit, I hope if anything happens it'll happen at sea and not home or another populated area.
"Well, you have to look and make your own decisions."
Huh?
"So where is the oil going to come from?... The Middle East, with two-thirds of the world's oil and the lowest cost, is still where the prize ultimately lies."
It's great to see some mention about 9/11 and inside job on a mainstream new source. We must never forget however, that the mainstream media has been vital in scaring the shit out of Americans with government propaganda. When the time comes for holding people accountable we absolutely must not forget the MSM. These giant companies need to be broken up. They need to be cleansed of psychological operations. I completely agree with those who think this antic is designed to get people to side against bush and the neocons when we must be wary of the other side of the isle also. Keep in mind that leading Democrats benefit from this war. Nancy Pelosi's husband is making an absolute killing. Stay focused on the big picture and don't let the elite minpulate us!
"... In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual." (Galileo Galilei, 1564 - 1642)
OIL IS OBSOLETE - WAKE UP - YOU'VE BEEN LIED TO, AGAIN! http://www.waterfuelcell.org/
Are you sure it's not Dianne Feinstein's husband your thinking of with respect to profiteering in Iraq?
If so, you wouldn't be the only one to get Pelosi and Feinstein mixed up.
Anyway, it should be clear that whatever fissures there are among the elites, none of them--neocon, neolib, whatever--wants the truth of 9/11 to come out. If the people get wise to how power really works, and how the powerful really think of them, then real, honest to god democracy will threaten to break out--and they'd be all finished, for their participation in this and all other scams up to this point.
That they are having to deal with 9/11 at all now is owing simply to the tenacity of this movement, aided by the internet. They would rather not have to deal with the issue at all, but they know how many of us now know, and they're not sure how to deal with it. Rosie's statements are a sign of progress--words spoken on network airwaves which certainly wouldn't have but for the existence and growth of this movement--but still, a certain wariness is in order in terms of what to expect next. Because, they would STILL rather not have to deal with us at all.
I am so proud of Rosie...what a fighter! Thank you for all that you are doing...keep fighting girl. For all of us that have felt the immense pain of finding the truth...keep the faith and be our voice!
This is amazing coverage.
Right now all these housewives are looking at Connor's site. Right now questions are in many people's minds.
We now know that Rosie is at minimum open to 9/11 truth.
Yes Connor with his anti-gay views is not the ideal candidate to get the truth out but he's one of the few that's doing it, so we need to be thankful for him and his antics.
This is HUGE, props to John Connor and his resistance! Amazing that it's actually working but it obviously is!
Are women typically attracted to shallow stupid men like John Conner? How would Rosie have responded if she knew John's religious beliefs particularly towards homosexuals?
In the meantime: Alex Jones (GCN) is promoting the notion that Global Warming Skeptics are being compared to Holocaust Deniers. Does he expose the Lies about the Holocaust, or does he maintain his position as a Zionist white-washing traitor?
Don't whine to me that he talks about Zionism. He isn't naming names, he denies Israel's involvement in 911, and prefers to continually bitch about the Mexican border while Palestinians and Iraqis are tortured, raped, and killed.
Too bad we couldn't get an email address for Rosie to make sure she feels a lot of support for breaking this topic out on mainstream television. The View. I looked but couldn't find no contact address to tell her thanks. Peace.
If Rosie wakes up to 9/11 truth, then it's just a matter of time till she puts 2 + 2 together and realizes she's completely nuts on the gun rights issue.
From reading his website, it appears to me that John Conner is a religious fanatic. I think that is a fair assessment, since he proudly states he uses Bible Prophecy as a research tool.
The following quotes from his home page are instructive:
“A large number of our political world leaders and corporate global elite are part of an intricate system of satanic secret societies. They believe Lucifer (Satan) set Man free in the Garden of Eden, and that the God of the Bible is the evil one.”
“Mormonism is a cult and the founder, Joseph Smith, was a Freemason. Mormons believe Jesus and Lucifer are brothers, and believe that they can become Gods, just like Satan said in the Garden of Eden.”
“Numerous sources including Ted Gunderson (ret. FBI), John Decamp (former US senator), Paul Bonacci (child abuse victim) and Rusty Nelson (Franklin Cover Up) report that Hunter S. Thompson produced snuff films in the Bohemian Grove in which people were murdered on film for entertainment.”
Notice the attack on Mormonism (I wonder what Steve Jones thinks about this). Notice the attack on Hunter S. Thompson (without any sources!).
If John Conner is not a paid disinfo agent then who needs ‘em!
Alex Jones seems to harbour similar views to John Conner. Perhaps he is partly motivated by the need to fill his news hour … or is there another agenda? He clearly has a strong interest in fanatical Christian thinking (cf. Texe Marrs, Michael Coffman) which is WORLDS APART from the progressive ideas of David Ray Griffin. The key difference is that the fanatics are appealing on a childish level to belief in simplistic notions of GOOD Vs EVIL and in the Bible as the Word of God.
In my opinion, being a Christian does not automatically require you to have these naïve and childish beliefs. Such beliefs are a wellspring of intolerance and are always used by those want to promote war. Such beliefs have no place in the 9/11 Truth Movement.
Michael Coffman’s website describes itself thus:
“Discerning the Times is a non-denominational ministry to the Christian Church and to all who desire to seek the truth about today's events as they relate to the Bible and biblical prophecy.”
On another page we read the following:
“While it is true that horrible deeds have been done in the name of Christianity by zealots who skewed the teachings of Christ, those deeds pale in comparison to the atrocities done in the name of Islam.”
I can assure you of one thing: If people promoting literalist interpretations of the Bible become a dominant voice in the 9/11 movement, then that movement will never, ever have a mainstream acceptance because the global mainstream is secular in outlook.
Please don't interpret what I am saying as anti-Christian - what I'm criticising are the childish attitudes of literalist Christians - these people are not fit representatives for a global movement which must be based on universal values. These people are not interested in universal values. They have a view which is essentially similar to G.W. Bush when he says, "you're either with us or you're with the terrorists". This week they support 9/11 Truth. Next week they may want to outlaw homosexuality.
shouting "9/11 was an inside job" through her cupped hands was an image I will cherish.
On the other, let's be realistic. Who in their right mind would want John Conner's site to be the first thing someone just starting to explore 9/11 sees?
I still think it's a net win, but no one should underestimate the counterproductive aspects of Conner's site.
...I'm a fan of (and amused by) Conner's 9/11 Bullhorn Activism, all the while realizing he's a problematic ally....due to some belief baggage that is alien to Joe NASCAR and Suzy Soccer-Mom...the people we need, to win...
And, I agree that The View's audience is not the best one for first exposure to 9/11 Truth being Conner's rants...this is complicated to assess whether it's a net gain or not....I still feel it more good than bad...
Brolin's View promotion of 911 Mysteries was much better messenger, message, and audience congruence for our purposes, though...
The truth is you don't really know what the net effect will be.
But consider this:
What if this is a disinfo operation? What if John Conner was created and planted and seeded onto braoadcast TV deliberately by the pysop department of the CIA?
His website is designed to tar and feather the 9/11 Truth movement. They do this because in a pseudo-democracy it is not possible to completely censor all news - some info always leaks out . So, what they do is they attempt to discredit this info by associating it with crackpots and fanatics, and by creating divisions within the movement. I believe this is their actual strategy.
Your argument reminds me of a person playing chess against a player who offers you a high value piece and you think - 'hmm ... this is a net gain' when by taking the piece you are subject to an inevitable checkmate in three moves.
As a matter of fact, I re-wrote that post a couple of times trying to be as diplomatic as possible with folks who are obviously high on the possibility that this was really what it seemed. "Net gain" should probably be replaced with "eh, most people probably won't check the website, but maybe they'll remember Rosie propagating the "inside job" meme." I hope it was not as much of a net loss as you believe it may turn out to be, but you are quite possibly right. BTW, I suck at chess.
(I can envision a number of really horrific outcomes here. For one thing, if Rosie really doesn't know about his views on gays and finds out --that's inevitable, right?-- she could misdirect her anger at the Truth movement in general.)
In the beginning I thought John Conner was a well intentioned maverick, but his website is such a nightmare that I cannot see the publicity he is getting as anything even remotely positive for 9/11 Truth.
He looks like someone with training in acting or performance or something, he is fit, articulate and funny. I would not have picked him for the type of person to walk around quoting Bible Prophecy.
I know that fundamentalist Christianity is very popular in America. In Australia it is not so common and we are more skeptical and suspicious of people who hold these views.
modes of of thought. For example, while Wagner was associated with the early Brownshirts he is mostly recognized as one of the greatest composers. His greater contribution eclipses the lesser.
The most compelling and truthful narratives will rise to the top.
Thats why many of us visit 911Blogger everyday rather than some of the less coherent sites.
As well, when we talk about an immensely important subject such as the truth of 9/11, John Conners views about homosexuality are irrelevant.
Anybody who turns out to be less than genuine will suffer similar annihilation as handed out to Fetzer, Wood and Reynolds.
This kind of critique, amidst the excitement and enthusiasm, is one of the healthiest things that can happen. There are ideologies and theories whose association with 9/11 truth are extremely destructive. We can all agree on some of them -- such as anti-Semitically-motivated Holocaust "denial." There are others with which the Truth movement needs to wrestle, including various kinds of religious intolerance and bigotry.
There is no need to qualify your remarks or to suggest that there is such a thing as Holocaust denial that is not anti-semitic. Holocaust denial is, intentionally or not, always anti-semitic just as denying the historical reality of slavery would be, intentionally or not, always racist.
misterguy, didnt you say you were gonna get off of this shit last week? remember? you said you were done turning this into a holocaust denial board. let. it. go.
"Notice the attack on Hunter S. Thompson (without any sources!)"
This has been documented. Just because he doesn't post links, doesn't mean that he is making this up. This information did not begin with John Conner. It began when Paul Bonacci, a victim of this sex/satanic ritual abuse/snuff ring, testified in court that a "Hunter Thompson" was involved.
I really hope that everyone has heard of the "Franklin coverup" and the CIA/government involvement in the child sex/kidnapping/satanic ritual abuse/snuff ring that is the main cause for the 250,000 missing/kidnapped children every year. If you haven't, take some time out to research it.
Apparently Bonnacci recalled that the name of a man who filmed the rape and murder of a young boy was Hunter Thompson.
I have a question - did he specifically identify Hunter S. THompson the writer, or did he merely say that the name of the mystery camera man was Hunter Thompson. This is an extremely important distinction don't you think?
The Gannon/Gosch connection was first made public early in the morning on Feb. 20. Later that same day, Hunter S. Thompson was found dead in his home, the victim of an apparent self-inflicted gunshot.
Few people would ever have thought to connect Thompson and Gosch, but those familiar with the tales of child abuse and pedophilia documented in "The Franklin Cover-Up," a book first released in 1994 by former Neb. State Sen. John DeCamp, understand the association.
In his book, DeCamp relates many interviews and discussions with Paul Bonacci, the young man who claims to have been involved with the kidnapping of Johnny Gosch. Bonacci told horrific tales of being forced into sex with adults and other children. In one case he recalls being flown into Nevada with another young boy whom he did not know. They took on another passenger there and headed to a secluded location where Bonacci says he was forced to have sex with the younger boy. The young boy, Bonacci claims in this book, was also forced to have sex with adult males, who then killed the boy with a gunshot to the head. Bonacci says he was then forced to have sex with the corpse.
The passenger they took on in Nevada filmed the entire thing, and Bonacci recalled that his name was Hunter Thompson.
"I think it's kind of strange that Hunter Thompson would commit suicide at this time," says Gunderson. "Several kids told us that he directed snuff films. I think it's a strong possibility that he was murdered and I strongly suspect that it's all connected."
And the speculation on the Internet has been that Thompson was either killed to prevent his coming forward, or that he killed himself because he feared his role as a director of child snuff films would be proven true.
is way over the top and has no place here. Thompson is dead and therefore cannot be tried or convicted in any court of law for these outrageous accusations. This is irresponsible, pointless speculation and doesnt help the matter at hand.
Allegations re Hunter Thompson and what he may have filmed at Bohemian Grove were cited as one reason to denigrate John Conner and distance ourselves from him. That's how this thread got started.
There may be sound reasons (sounds like there are)to consider John Conner a loon, or even a disinfo agent, but I don't think including the topic of pedophile rings, the Franklin cover-up etc., on his website is one of them. I first learned about this stuff through Wayne Madsen, around the time that Jeff Gannon was exposed as a fake-journalist plant in the White House press corps, back in early 2005.
And what are you talking about "an ABC endorsement of GCN"? As far as I know GCN pays ABC to use their satellite for their broadcasts. But I doubt this was any kind of plug for GCN. Are you being serious or joking?
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
you guys might be REALLY onto something...
with this gcn/abc connection
would not be surprised at all
gcn a fake controlled opposition network---secretly ran by abc???
possibly not also.....
but here's how you can tell that alex jones is shilling
he NEVER mentions the attempted bombing of the mexican parliament building in oct 2001-----by mossad with bombs
--------------------------------------
guess it doesnt matter at this point in the 911 movement ....
He doesn't screen calls, so you should call in on Monday between 12-3pm est:
1-800 259 9231
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
Yep, Alex doesn't talk about one issue and of course he's shilling.
It's so blatantly obvious that the man is a shill. I mean, how many people has he turned on to 9/11 Truth? Perhaps 90% of us? What a pathetic number. It should be 100%!
Alex Jones is a shill because he gets angry and doesn't expose EVERY OUNCE OF 9/11 NEWS EVERY DAY!
unlike all that dancing israeli art fag bullshit...
the attempted bombing by mossad of the mexican natl parliament building in oct 2001----
directly implicates mossad
alex jones works for pro israeli interests----he can slightly criticize them---
but the mex parliament story is a big no no
----------------------------------------------------------------
to me ---that story is even bigger than wtc 7---
Why? Who benefits? Did ABC let this happen or make it happen?
Did the blond who started the conversation (don't know her name) sneak it on with Rosie? Rosie appeared to know what was coming.
Did they sneak this past ABC or was it ABC's idea?
I still think all publicity is good publicity. And even though John's site may not be the perfect 9/11 truth site, it does have some eye opening links.
On a side note: I have it on good authority that a well respected NY Times reporter was personally handed a copy of 911 Mysteries this past Wednesday. The DVD was given to him by a close and respected acquaintenance who is an outspoken critic of the mainstream media and a 9/11 truther. If the Times breaks a story on it, you'll know where you heard about it first. If not, bummer.
Ken that's huge.
But how many established mainstream reporters have seen videos like 911 Mysteries and Loose Change and gone on to do nothing on reporting about them? Seems like it's probably happened a lot, throughout the country. Also, the NYT is owned and controlled by the CFR, and is where ALL mainstream newspapers get their top stories, so I'm doubtful that this reporter will do anything about the information he has.
A quote from my friend's email regarding the Times reporter...
"We had lunch in the city on Wednesday and wouldn't you know it, the subject of 9/11 came up. Hmmm... He hadn't really heard all that much about it, and he knew that some of the early accusations had been debunked, and there really wasn't that much talk about it in the office. Wouldn't you also know it, I happened to have a DVD of 911 Mysteries with me! Now HE has it. If the Times breaks a story on this, you'll know where it came from."
Without revealing too much about my source, let me just say that this particular Times reporter recently wrote an article about the huge cost of the Iraq war. And that this particular Times reporter was once a student of the person who gave him the DVD.As such, the Times reporter already deeply respects my friend – in a big way.
This could play out one of two ways...
The reporter watches the movie, gets interested, watches more movies, researches on the net, proposes a piece to his editor and
a.Gets told to drop the story.
b.Runs with the story and the shit hits the fan
My friend will be following up in a few days and if I hear anything worth reporting I will.
Sorry, but I'd be shocked if he tried to run with this and didn't lose his job. Remember the sad tale of Gary Webb and how his paper, the San Jose Mercury News, ultimately caved into the pressure, and pulled him from the story. And the New York Times was one of the vehicles most active in creating that pressure to stop revealing the truth about government ties to cocaine smugglers.
I had the great pleasure of hearing David Ray Griffin speak in New York back in the fall of 2005, and the only point in his presentation where my reaction was, 'Huh?', was when he called upon the New York Times to 'take the lead' in exposing the truth of 9/11. As the gentleman sitting next to me remarked, 'Don't hold your breath!'
who would be afraid of getting arrested if they spoke out about 9/11. We don't need that kind of cowardice within our ranks. So if this teevee show helps keep the cowards out who really cares? Not me.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
To me it sounded like Rosie (and the other woman) respected 9/11 truth activism. I also think they did an overall positive thing for the 9/11 truth movement by discussing it. To me Rosie seems like a person who isn't afraid to speak her mind, so I really don't think she would allow herself to be compromised into helping a sinister group of people who are covering up 9/11.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
the interpretation I got from watching the video clip was that Rosie O'Donnell has probably looked into 9/11 before and doesn't believe the official story. She appeared genuinely offended when the young blonde laughed at the idea of 9/11 being an inside job. She made a defensive remark by telling the woman to look into it and make her own decision.
If this is some sort of set up, I don't think she's in on it.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
is CFR.... I really don't think that she is down with all this talk but there's nothing she can say to stop it without being fingered as CFR and revealing her affiliation. Rosie flicked her off when James Brolin said it the first time.
Notice this second time that Barbara was MIA.
___________________
Ignorance is NOT Bliss
WOW, John Conner must have be having a pretty positive affect to get a mention from those ladies like that. He's just gone way up in my estimation, I must have underestimated him a bit.
From Loose Change blog:
"Louder Than Words LLC will no longer be able to participate in the upcoming 9/11 Accountability Conference in Arizona on February 23rd - 25th, due to the involvement of Eric D. Williams who has authored a book promoting Holocaust denial, entitled "The Puzzle Of Auschwitz."" http://loosechange911.blogspot.com/
And now from the Arizona conference site:
"As a result of the controversy surrounding Eric D. Williams, he has stepped down from involvement in the 9/11 Accountability Conference. The 911 Accountability Conference does not support Holocaust denial, nor does the 9/11 Truth Movement. No speaker listed here is known to have published works related to the Holocaust." http://911accountability.org/accountability/index.php
Three cheers for Loose Change! I have new-found respect for you guys and much hope for the Final Cut.
9/11 Truth associations with Holocaust denial are suicidal for this movement. And the fake nazi moles know it. That's why they're here.
And guess what: I'm not Jewish. I'm a cathoic-born agnostic.
Ask questions. Seek truth. Most importantly, deny foregone conclusions!
"I'm posting this from Kevin's latest email for two reasons--it mentions his show tonight with the phone number at the end of the text, AND because I had attempted to post this as a blog but it disappeared in the ether. In any case it does touch on the subjects of 9/11, religion, and bigotry...
"Holocaust Myth" Libel Debunked
[This Friday on Truth Jihad Radio, 6-8 p.m. CT, http://republicbroadcasting.org, I will be discussing "bigotry, accusations of bigotry, and their role in interfaith dialogue and the 9/11 truth movement" with my guests Carol Brouillet and James Powell]
Last year, during a guest appearance on a Madison, Wisconsin talk radio show, the host compared 9/11 skeptics to "people who think the Holocaust is a myth." "Of course it's a myth," I responded, explaining that the word myth, in the academic sense, means: "Sacred narrative that is believed to be true, and that often inaugurates and legitimizes a social order or a way of understanding the world." Scholars are far more interested in the social and political effects of myths than whether or not they are true, I continued. Calling the Holocaust a myth, and exploring the destructive effects of that myth, as Norman Finkelstein does, says nothing about whether the story is true or false.
After a commercial break, the host came back with: "We're talking to Dr. Kevin Barrett, who says the Holocaust is a myth." That host was either an idiot or a liar, for he was confusing, whether deliberately or through sheer stupidity, the academic and popular senses of the word myth, only a few minutes after I had clearly explained the distinction.
Last week, a blog entry by Mark (gravy) Roberts from the blogs section at 911blogger.com, citing an out-of-context fragment of a private email, repeated the "Barrett calls Holocaust myth" libel. Of course it's a myth, Mark! That doesn't mean it isn't true. I have no doubt that among the 60 million people killed in World War II, a great many were Jews who were killed because they were Jews, Gypsies killed because they were Gypsies, homosexuals killed because they were homosexuals, communists killed because they were communists, Slavs killed because they were Slavs--and, perhaps worst of all, decent people killed because they were decent people who insisted on telling the truth in the face of a lying, war-criminal regime.
This does not mean that the Holocaust narrative is not a myth! In a scientific culture, one would expect the dominant myths to be empirically true--meaning backed by empirical evidence, not true in an absolute sense. Evolution, the big bang theory, the Holocaust, Pearl Harbor, the story of Muhammad's reception of the Qur'an, Genesis, the Gospels of Jesus, etc. are all examples of myths that are used by contemporary communities. Whether they are empirically true or not is irrelevant to their status as myths. I regularly use these examples in the classes I teach, and whenever the subject of mythography (the academic study of myths) comes up. Occasionally Muslims look askance at my characterization of their (our) sacred narrative as a myth, while others react badly to my characterization of the Holocaust as a myth -- even though I NEVER do so without explaining the term first! The moral: An educator's job is never done.
That said, I do think that Americans are going to have to get used to the fact that most of the world's Arabs and Muslims who have an opinion think the Jewish Holocaust body count has been exaggerated by Western historians, due to the natural tendency of the victor to rewrite history at the expense of the vanquished. The Arab world's leading statesman and political commentator, Mohammed Heikal, does not deny the Holocaust, but he claims that after conducting extensive research he believes that the true number of Jewish victims was less than one million. I suspect that very few of the world's 200 million Arabs or 1.5 billion Muslims would disagree with him. Personally, I have no idea who is right, the Western consensus or Heikal and other non-Western intellectuals and their Western supporters. I simply have not had the time or interest to do the research necessary to have an informed opinion on this question. If refusing to accept someone else's sacred story on faith makes me a heretic, I plead guilty. Given the ludicrous lies about 9/11 and other matters that have been perpetrated by Western academia, media, and governments, I think anyone who accepts anything these Western institutions say about anything, without personally verifying it through careful research, is a gullible person indeed.
The point of this fence-straddling is dialogue. As a person who has lived on various sides of various cultural fences, I see my interfaith-dialogue role as one of helping each side understand the other. This is not always easy. Arabs and Muslims generally regard pro-Zionists in almost exactly the same way that Jews and most Americans regard pro-Nazis or "Holocaust deniers"—as defenders of the indefensible who must be morally corrupt if not downright evil. I have spent countless hours talking to Arabs and Muslims trying to explain why Americans and especially American Jews think the way they do, and pointing out that pro-Zionists are not necessarily evil. Likewise I am sometimes compelled to explain to Americans why the Arab-Muslim world is essentially unanimous in questioning both the numbers and the meaning of the standard Western version of the Nazi Holocaust narrative, and trying to point out that 1.5 billion people may be wrong without being evil. This is often a thankless task. Extremists on one side call me a Holocaust denier while those on the other side call me a Jew-loving race traitor. (DB Smith actually called for me to be arrested as a Mossad agent because I am so friendly with Jews!) Interestingly, those extremists are virtually never Muslim—they're all white power types. Anti-Zionist Muslims are almost always polite and open to dialogue. It's just that nobody on this side of the fence wants to hear them–maybe because their argument about Palestine, and the irrelevance of the Holocaust story to it, is so compelling?
[Questions? Comments? Rotten tomatoes? Call in this Friday, 2/10/07, on Truth Jihad Radio, 6-8 p.m. CT, http://republicbroadcasting.org: (800) 313-9443]"
____
Should these guys be banned by DZ, jfal? What about it DZ, is it necessary to set a policy around these issues, real or hyped, and ban individuals and topics?
And jfal, please define and identify the exact individuals and ideas that are not acceptable to you and recommend some pragmatic solutions to deal the problems you identify.
Let me see, you think there's a problem with the site. Do you:
a--email the moderator(s) explaining your problem clearly and susinctly, knowing that the message will get to the person/people responsible and who have actual power to solve the alledged problem.
Or--
b--make a long winded, badly formatted, hard to read post, not even remotely on topic, or even on the same planet, knowing full well you are provoking drama?
Me, I always go for "a", but then I have a low drama tolerance. You're apparently a "b" kind of guy/gal. Hope that works out for you, sunbeam.
Sorry if you cant handle difficult subject matter that impacts everybody on the site.
jfals name calling should be addressed. I'll post what I like and.will be raising this subject matter on future posts. Please respond without the nuanced hostility.
You seem to be a very controlling individual; are you in the military? I dont take orders from anybody.
Whatever--[insert mild Brit insult for obtuse foolish person].
Let's review reading comprehension: I did not give you an order. I was, however, showing you HOW what you're doing will not accomplish anything except--let's see, what's the word I'm looking for--Oh yeah! Hostility! Pointless, endless hostility! So I guess if that's what you want, carry on.
But, if it amuses you, by all means continue your passive/ agressive attempts to provoke me---into laughter.
And don't forget to vote the apologists comments DOWN!
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
Thanks for your great
Thanks for your great submissions today Stallion4! :)
Hey thanks, dz
Couldn't do it without your great website;)
If you have time could you please set up something for this story at the "digg it" website?
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
I am giddy
I've never said that before, but I think that's what I am. Me thinks the dam just broke.
Thanks, and got you setup.
Thanks, and got you setup. Just figured out how to put that neat counter on the entries, so now we can see how many diggs we have.. Thanks again!
FYI, the Kucinich thread got ~50 diggs, but was burried by others, so it never made it to the front page.. So everyone needs to chip in and digg these things!
Groovey. thanks! saves me the trip.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
jeez.. i just checked the
jeez.. i just checked the digg.com wtc7 thread from this morning.. it got 40+ diggs, but was buried as well.. it looks like 2 threads now that would have made digg top pages got 'buried' and hidden.. hrm.
Is there still hope for this one?
http://digg.com/world_news/New_stunning_9_11_testimonies_WTC_Building_7_...
It's at 12 Diggs right now.
Also, does it matter if links to stories at digg.com are clicked on here? Someone posted here a while ago saying that it lessons the story's chance of reaching the top pages. Whether or not that's true I dunno.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
that isnt the one we had..
that isnt the one we had.. we were using this one:
http://digg.com/world_news/WTC_Building_7_ON_THE_RECORD
it is at 50, but if you search for it you wont find it unless you click 'show buried'..
the one you reference with 12 diggs isn't burried yet, so im going to switch out that blog with it:
http://www.911blogger.com/node/6078
Copy that. I'm sure JREFers and other government apologists
are crawling all over that website burying 9/11 truth.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
And the government
And the government apologists are gonna still be in denial, cowering in fear of Al Queda and bowing to their masters while we fight the new revolution.
The bombshells continue to drop. The official story is being incinerated daily.
What kind of "conspiracy theory" GROWS exponentially each year?
We're winning! Keep it up!
Nevermind, dz
I just remembered I can post the link to the youtube video there. I'll post the Digg it link here after I do.
already did, look at the
already did, look at the story, here is the digg link:
http://digg.com/videos/people/Rosie_O_Donnell_Impersonates_John_Conner_b...
:-)
Thank you!
Spread this video link!!
This will all help the video move up in the ranking on YouTube and get thousands more viewers!
Rosie, you sly dog closet truther you.
After the bubble head, bleach blond, republicrat speaks up she say's, "Go look & make your own decisions".
That's all we ask.
Send an E-mail to ABC
Send an e-mail to the ABC television network through their online e-mail form saying that you're glad the subject of 9/11 is being discussed on the show. Do it now. It's imperative that they get positive feedback about the subject being discussed on the air!
http://abc.go.com/site/contactus.html
Amazing!
That was awesome!
Seriously, that nearly brought tears to my eyes because the way they were discussing it was so matter of fact.
I'm so impressed. I'm sure this is only going to motivate John Conner 100 times more.
We want it to motivate...
....the 100 (1000?) John Conner CLONES....
....and, it just might....
oh boy...
from the resistance manifesto website...
"A dark web of evil is exposed like never before, making Bible Prophecy and the New World Order crystal clear. Learn the most powerful information on the 9/11 inside job, plans for the rise of the Antichrist, the institutions, people, and powers involved, and how you can fight them."
yeah, great endorsement for the truth. let's see, we have, on his homepage, talk of prophecies, cults, the antichrist, end times, satanic secret societies, etc., but no talk or understanding of geopolitics, apartheid, war crimes, or anything relevant. this guy is a deranged kook, plain and simple. i wouldn't be the least bit surprised if he was a controlled asset, either.
This is good exposure for 9/11
I can't believe Rosie actually said the words "9/11 was an inside job" and then they responded with "well look into it for yourself everyone".
To me, this sort of media permissiveness of 9/11 might be an indication that there will be an effort to try to co-opt the truth of 9/11, make into an exclusively anti-Bush/neo-con movement and justify increased globalism and foreign intervention.
Whatever your politics are, 9/11 involved more than one narrow group of ideologues, and the complicity goes way back to the Carter administration and even further when you look at the muslim brotherhood, etc.
Let's embrace the exposure but stay on message with provable facts and not allow the truth to be coopted for political aims.
Agreed, Swmorgan77
I think this is part of the roll out of the inevitable limited hangout we know will be put forward.
Additionally, this steers those watching "The View" to a less than ideal website insuring that their first impression of 9/11 Truth will be that it is promoted by kooks. It is too little, too late, imo.
The truth shall set us free. Love is the only way forward.
Be well.
are you kidding?
i guess with some people every silver cloud has a dark lining.
this is tremendous. opinions are like assholes - everyone has one.
ya know - the one thing consistent i've learned over the years is that the phrase "limited hangout" is a sure-fire way of squashing legitimate avenues of inquiry.
oh - don't recommend "Press for the Truth" because its limited hangout.
oh - Albanese's film is limited hangout.
oh - don't ever talk about the alleged hijackers because that's limited hangout.
oh - don't ever say a plane hit the Pentagon beause that's limited hangout.
I've been hearing this phrase since 2003 and its tired. 4 years ago the 9/11 truth movement was a handfull of people nationwide - and the media would not even whisper a HINT of the subject. there was a 100% air-tight media black out on the subject.
now, MILLIONS are tuned in and demanding answers. it is frankly LAUGHABLE to suggest that all of this attention is a grand plot to herd us into a "limited hangout" holding pen.
PUH-LEEZE!
either do something positive for this movement - or take your sour grapes to Nico Haupt's website where you can accuse everyone and every line of legitimate research and every postive development a 'limited hangout.'
But
But theresistancemanifesto.com is a less than ideal choice.
i am learning
to take what we can get.
you see - the truth is not located in anyone place. you will not find teh truth in Loose Change or in Alex Jones. You will not find the truth in my film. You will not find the truth at 911Truth.org.
But - public awareness continues to carry the movement - as a whole - forward. Less than idea websites won't deter people from seeing past the imperfections and coming to understand that 911 truth is a phenomenon - FOR A REASON.
i STARTED in this movement as a Pentagon theorist. i now REJECT the no-planes theories. but - the pentagon opened pandora's box for me. for others it was Loose Change - another highly problematic source.
we may not be able to find the truth in any one place - but this movement is sustained by the fact that government LIES and COVERUPS and COINCIDENCES are everywhere.
plus
99% of the View's audience will not even go to the website. all they know is that they heard Rosie and Brolin BOTH say on national television that 911 was an inside job.
That's powerful.
Fans
Fans of Rosie are just as committed as those to Oprah.... they are smarter that we seem to be giving them credit.
___________________
Ignorance is NOT Bliss
it would be nice if rosie
it would be nice if rosie was real-----but she pointed towards the controlled opposition shill site
but she sure is leaving a good example for others to yell out 911was an inside job on tv
but she implied that a person "gets arrested" for saying it-----and that is not true
maybe in the end...it'll turn out that she's a real awesome lady
weirder things have happened
I, for one, whole-heartedly agree with you, John.
I certainly do not agree with some of Conner's views or tactics. But this is a GOOD thing people. Remember, it takes all kinds to make a world.
I think it's my turn to hit you with the creme pie, Mr. Albanese
If you carefully read what i wrote you'll see that my "limited hangout" is clearly being applied to the msm represented by "The View". Do you think that this plug for John Connor was an accident?
I simply do not trust ANYTHING that comes out in the msm like this and look for the subtext. The perps are clearly very concerned and are desperately trying to come up with a limited hangout option they think they can sell. It won't work, too much is known by too many already.
I have never, nor will ever, attempt to squash anyone's avenue of inquiry.
I also think you need to calm down a bit (decaf?) and not immediately jump to conclusions and be so accusatory. Why the hysterics? Is it that you see red when you see the phrase "limited hangout"?
Please read my post on this subject on another thread.
I have shown 9/11 Press for Truth to many people, it is the first dvd I offer to people who are completely unaware of 9/11 Truth or who are highly resistant for whatever reason. I have had extraordinary success showing people this excellent film and am working with the producers to get it into theaters all over northern California.
I recently attended the Media Reform conference in Memphis where we sold many copies of PFT. At this same conference I personally put a copy of PFT, along with other materials, into Phil Donohue's hands and told him that if he watched the first 5 minutes of PFT that he would want to watch it to the end.
Mr. Albanese, you strike me as a very intelligent person, however, continued knee-jerk reactions like this will only cause people to lose respect for you and damage your credibility.
Perhaps we can hit each other with creme pies simultaneously. Please make mine a chocolate creme pie.
I hope that you and yours are well.
The truth shall set us free. Love is the only way forward.
I have to agree...
I am slightly bemused by the posts in this thread by John Albanese, as I had thought he was of above average intelligence. Now I am rethinking that position.
I would like to drive home the point that John Conner is a FAKE.
It is just so bloody obvious.
I already posted a more thoughtful comment about this in the thread, and I also attempted to post it to my blog on 911Blogger but it has mysteriously failed to appear.
What has happened to the smart people on this website? Its very disappointing to see you all supporting this nonsense.
Editor - 911oz.com
www.911oz.com
most believe there is no such thing as "bad publicity"...
i disagree
I've always found Conner's style a bit of a turn-off, similar to Alex Jones. It makes every skeptic look like a madman.
I still think it was just a GCN plug.
Guys like Jones and Conner don't offer solutions, they just rely on fear-mongering and shouting in what I see as an attempt to create a fanbase who will buy and promote their works, similar to Howard Stern's "shockvalue" of the 90s.
But what do I know...
/////////////////////
911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
Yes, However I Do Smell Something Rotten
I have watched his bullhorn antics which were posted here a while back. At that time I thought he seemed like an amusing if a little socially inept activist.
But now that I've seen his lurid website I defintely smell a rat. This guy ain't what he seems to be folks. Why do you think he goes out of his way to smear Hunter S. Thompson, who was, as we know, trying to expose 9/11 just before he was "suicided"?
I don't believe he believes that bullsh*t about the antichrist - it's just a disinfo tactic, like all the others.
Editor - 911oz.com
www.911oz.com
Why don't you believe that
Why don't you believe that he believes there will be an anti-christ? Many, many people believe that and I am one of them. Being a Christian means that you believe the Bible is literal and that there is a God, that Jesus died on the cross for our sins and that includes the book of Revelation. This has nothing, I repeat nothing at all to do with disinfo in any way.
John Conner is real and he truly believes in God.
How does he go "out of his way to smear Hunter S. Thompson"? He didn't himself make up, what he says on his site, about Thompson. He put it on his site based off of the investifation conducted by former Senator John DeCamp and former head of the L.A. FBI Ted Gunderson. Their investigation produced witnesses to this. One was a photographer and one was a victim (Paul Bonacci) of the CIA's child sex/kidnapping/satanic ritual sacrifice ring who said that Thompson produced the snuff films.
I wouldn't hide information like that about one of the "alleged" participants just because he was involved in exposing 9/11 as an inside job.
how come there are no dinosaurs in the bible?
I always wondered that...
/////////////////////
911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
Good question. I've wondered
Good question. I've wondered the same thing in the past. Recently I've come to realize that it does talk about dinosaurs in the Bible.
Since you asked...
The Bible uses ancient names like "behemoth" and "tannin." Behemoth means kingly, gigantic beasts. Tannin is a term which includes dragon-like animals and the great sea creatures such as whales, giant squids, and marine reptiles like the plesiosaurs that may have become extinct.
God has revealed to us the major events of history from the beginning of time to enable us to build a way of thinking to understand the universe.
When one accepts the history timeline as outlined in Scripture, it is easy to explain dinosaurs. When one understands that land animals (including dinosaurs) were made on the sixth day of creation—that there was no death (of animals or man) or disease (there are dinosaur bones that show evidence of diseases like cancer) before sin—that all the land animal kinds (including dinosaurs) were on the Ark—and that many animal groups (including dinosaurs) have died out since the Flood (because sin, the curse, and the Flood affected the world)—then it’s easy to explain the history of dinosaurs.
Also, there is a lot of evidence (such as carvings and paintings of dinosaur-like creatures)—and (unfossilized) dinosaur bone with red blood cells—that makes sense in the light of the biblical account of history. Did you know that a dinosaur may be described in detail in the Bible? Check out Job 40:15–19. And if the notes in your Bible state that this animal was an elephant or hippo, read the passage again to see that this can’t be so.
Did you know the word “dinosaur” was first invented in 1841? Dinosaurs were probably called “dragons” before that time. And the Hebrew word for “dragon” is used a number of times in the Old Testament. There are also dragon legends prevalent in cultures around the world. It’s possible these are accounts of encounters with beasts we today call dinosaurs.
The reason many Christians have been unable to give answers about dinosaurs is because they have tried to “fit” them into the Bible—instead of using the Bible and its true account of history to explain them. This is done in detail in my book The Great Dinosaur Mystery Solved.
DHS, by the way, man, thanks for the DVDs. I appreciate it.
"Did you know that a
"Did you know that a dinosaur may be described in detail in the Bible? Check out Job 40:15–19. And if the notes in your Bible state that this animal was an elephant or hippo, read the passage again to see that this can’t be so."
very very sad and pathetic response :(
Actually, I copied and
Actually, I copied and pasted that because I wanted to quickly answer his question. The part you pointed out was just one small part of what I posted. I gave historical and factual information in relation to the other parts.
I'm not going to discuss dinosaurs in the Bible in this thread. I could really get into this, but this is not the place. I believe the Bible is the Word of God and I am a Christian. I've spent all of my life studying the Bible and trying to be a better person and a better Christian. I believe it with everything that I am so I'll just leave it at that.
I know plenty of Christians
I know plenty of Christians who DO NOT believe the Bible is literal. You have to know this. I'd even bet that MOST don't believe the Bible is literal. Unless you're prepared to stone people for disobeying their parents.
I will respect your beliefs, but please stop talking out your arse.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
I know that many Christians
I know that many Christians do not believe it's literal, but if that's the case, does that mean the Bible is not the Word of God? If that's the case, then what is a Christian? Someone who believes in a figurative Jesus or someone who believes Jesus was real, but the Bible is not the Word of God? This is a very conflicting issue with many sides.
The Bible doesn't teach that you should be stoned for your sins or stone someone else for their sins. This was in the Old Testament and these things are an account of happened then. That is the old covenant. After Jesus died, that covenant was broken. So, the old laws from the Old Testament, such as only wearing certain types of clothing and things like that, were done away with.
About 35-38%
of Christians which is about 20% of the USA are Fundamentalist nut jobs that take the Bible as literal.
That is about 60 Million delusional psychotics in this country.
Scary
True, very scary--but as you
True, very scary--but as you point out this is only 1/5 of Christians in the states. MOST Christians are tolerant reasonable people(like MOST people).
The problem is Jason's definition of a "Christian" is ludicrously narrow. Basically he's saying Fundamentalists are the ONLY Christians. It is that sort of arrogant mentality that led to Protestants and Cathlolics burning each other in the 16th-17th centuries.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
I actually
understand where he is coming from and technically he is correct.
35+% is over 1/3 BTW not 1/5.
Its about 1/5 the whole population, but only about 71-73% of the population claim to be Christian today, down from the 86% in 1990.
I believe what he is getting at is that you are a Christian by name only unless you are Fundy nut job.
and if you look at it using the very same dogma that all Christians claim they follow then that book gives fairly precise actions & beliefs one must adhere to in order to be a Christian.
There is no way possible to follow the vast majority of the lunacy in the bible without treating it as 100% infallible and literal.
In that respect he is correct.
Also that "arrogant mentality" is almost always inflicted onto one religious group towards another religious group based solely on how each group "interprets" their chosen dogma.
Protestants Vs Catholics, Muslims Vs Christians and so on.
It boils down to some just completely leaving their brains at the church doorstep and deciding to deny factual reality at all cost no matter how irrefutable (Fundy's) Vs those that are still trying to pick and chose what they want to believe because so much of any given religious dogma is utterly insane they try and work around it by simply choosing a few points they like and making excuses about the rest.
Such as making an excuse about not having to adhere to Old Testament doctrines when in fact without the OT doctrine the NT is completely moot.
For instance if you don't follow/believe Genesis then how could you possibly be a Christian?
Either the mythical Christian sun god created the Earth, all life, trillions of stars and the void in between with a wave of his magic wand just a few 1000 years ago or he didn't.
All of the main tenets of Christianity are found in the OT so to dismiss it as no longer valid because of the NT is dishonest at best.
Agree that the "NT"
Agree that the "NT" clause--how it's used is dishonest.
What we have a case of here is not distinguishing between inspired spirituallity and religous dogma. Fundamentalists believe dogma IS religion/spirituality--if I follow these pavlovian contradictory rules I will be saved--from something. Everybody else, including Chriustians who are not Fundies, use religion/myth/philosophy/common sense to inspire themselves to be better people--and if someone way back in ANY testament got it wrong, that bit has got to GO.
I am worried that ANYONE is trained to think moral judgment is found in a book that cannot be questioned. Moral people of ALL creeds know ultimate moral responsibility for your actions is yours alone--the Bible made me do it DOES NOT cut it.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
Exactly
Jenny, that pretty much sums it up.
Sadly a huge chunk of the American public are delusional psychotics that get their moral compass from a book written by nobody knows whom about 1900 years ago that was largely copied from much older Paganism from Sumeria, Babylon, Kemet , who's origin was around 2000BCE.
Bronze age morals of what amounts to savages of which blood sacrifice, slavery, killing people that merely broke a simple religious law such as, picking up fire wood to keep warm with on the Sabbath and other such triviality was considered socially acceptable & morally correct.
To believe this tripe I can only come to the conclusion that they must be insane and should be treated as such, religious loons need our pity & help, they need psychotherapy & heavy medication.
Unfortunately because of mass delusion & political correctness those of us not insane can not even touch upon this subject as the moniker of religion acts as a shield protecting those that have lost all concept of factual reality.
They become immune to mental evaluation hiding behind Religion.
Paraphrasing Sam Harris a bit, I think most people would agree that you would have to be a complete lunatic to be certain of Poseidon, for instance. If someone was going to run a political campaign and as part of their stump speech they said these hurricanes in the Gulf have become an increasing concern, and we have to start praying to Poseidon, the god who deals with the ocean. This is a crazy thing to say. Everyone would recoil, it would be the end of that person's political career immediately right on the spot, and yet we are talking as though there was some epistemological difference between talking about Poseidon and talking about the God of Abraham, and there isn't except for the number of fools that believe it.
If this same politician simply came out and said he was an Atheist he would get the same treatment and his political career is over and probably get a few death threats while hes at it from all those fine moral Christians.
Yet if this same politician said we must "pray to god" (meaning the christian sun god of course) to stop these hurricanes then that is just fine as a matter of fact it would expected of him to say something that ridiculous.
In the case of King George the W he has actually said that he personally talks to his little invisible friend and that is whom told him to attack Iraq.
In a world not run by delusional psychotics such a statement should assure him of a week or 2 in an asylum with mandatory weekly treatments & medications.
Instead such a statement gets him high praise from about 70% of the population.
Somehow this has got to change or we are in the fast lane towards extinction as a species.
"To believe this tripe I can
"To believe this tripe I can only come to the conclusion that they must be insane and should be treated as such, religious loons need our pity & help, they need psychotherapy & heavy medication.
Unfortunately because of mass delusion & political correctness those of us not insane can not even touch upon this subject as the moniker of religion acts as a shield protecting those that have lost all concept of factual reality.
They become immune to mental evaluation hiding behind Religion."
Wow...that's an extremely delusional and baseless statement. My mental stability is perfectly fine. I'm a very smart, intelligent, logical, thoughtful, caring person. Psychology has been something that has fascinated me since I was 10 years old. At that age, I started studying human thought and emotional behaviour. The human mind and individuals thought processes have always fascinated me. I've "profiled" probably every person I've ever encountered since that time. So, trust me, I know how mentally unstable people are. I know better than almost amyone how people think and how "crazy" and deluded "people" are. I am not one of them.
I am far from perfect, but how dare you imply that I am "insane and should be treated as such, religious loons need our pity & help, they need psychotherapy & heavy medication"? C'mon, now, even I see that as a very extreme assumption.
Anyone can become a Christian. You can't lump all Christians together just as you can't lump any "group" of people together.
"You can't lump all
"You can't lump all Christians together just as you can't lump any "group" of people together."
That was part of OUR point when YOU implied to be a Christian one had to believe the Bible was the literal word of God--as opposed to the words of humans inspired by their sincere beliefs.
So if anyone is having trouble seeing the diversity of your own religon, that's YOU, sunshine.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
I know the extreme range of
I know the extreme range of diversity better than anyone. I don't know what you're saying. I think I've made it clear that I see the diversity.
This topic shouldn't even be one that divides us or one that is discussed here. I love you guys and I'm very thankful for all of you. I don't want our belief in God to seperate us. Beliefs in holograms I can see, but not this.
"In the case of King George
"In the case of King George the W he has actually said that he personally talks to his little invisible friend and that is whom told him to attack Iraq."
Bush is not a Christian and the same for H.W. Bush. W. Bush studies the Talmud. It has nothing do to with the Bible. H.W. passed into law the "Seven Noahide Laws" that will make it legal to kill Christians when the time comes they feel that this is necessary. The "Seven Noahide Laws" are satanic, anti-Christian and come from the Talmud. This ties in directly with Bible prophesy in the end times when Christians will be killed for stating that they believe in Jesus Christ. Why would a "Christian" man pass these "Noahide Laws" into law? They wouldn't.
When Bush said he was "fulfilling the Ancient Hope of the New Order of the Ages", he was not talking about anything to do with Christianity. This is something that's rooted in the occult.
These men, along with many other world "leaders" worship an ancient "secret" occult teaching. They also worship the owl god "Molech" at a ceremony performed at the Bohemian Grove and they've been involved in satanic and occult practices while members of the group Skull and Bones and other "secret societies". It's documented and it is occult and satanic. It has nothing to do with Christianity or believing in, trusting and knowing Christ in any way. They are the exact opposite. I don't know what voice Bush was hearing, but it wasn't Jesus Christ.
Jenny, I do not get my moral
Jenny, I do not get my moral compass from the Bible.
I am not a "psychotic nut job". My morals come from the everything that I've experienced and from putting things together and looking at all sides of every situation. It just so happens that for me, my morals and the was I see things are the same as the things that Jesus Christ taught.
I believe that Jesus died on the cross for the sins of every person and that the Bible is the Word of God. One day, everyone will find out for themselves. Until then, I will continue to serve Jesus Christ, help everyone that I can, help to expose the lies and deceptions of this world, educate myself on what's going on in the world and help to bring down the new world order. I will do all of this with the love of Jesus Christ in my heart. That is who I am.
"Such as making an excuse
"Such as making an excuse about not having to adhere to Old Testament doctrines when in fact without the OT doctrine the NT is completely moot.
For instance if you don't follow/believe Genesis then how could you possibly be a Christian?
Either the mythical Christian sun god created the Earth, all life, trillions of stars and the void in between with a wave of his magic wand just a few 1000 years ago or he didn't.
All of the main tenets of Christianity are found in the OT so to dismiss it as no longer valid because of the NT is dishonest at best."
It's not an "excuse". Christians are simply not required to follow the Old Testament laws because Jesus died on the cross for our sins. The Bible is divided into the Old Testament and the New Testament for a reason. The Old Testament is the old covenant. After Jesus died on the cross, that covernant was broken. The New Testament is the new covenant because Christ took our sins and that includes the old laws of the Old Testament. It's not an excuse. It's the way that it is.
There is a huge difference in "believing" and "following" the Old Testament. They are two completely different things. I know that many people do not understand the difference between the Old and the New Testamnets and that people still think the Bible teaches what is recorded in the Old Testament, but anyone who studies this knows the difference.
So if there was never the
So if there was never the Crucifiction you would feel obligated to follow all the Old Testament laws of the ancient Hebrews? Just so we're clear, this includes killing your children if they talk back; sacking/ raping/pillaging your enemies because you think God told you to; justifying incest?
Have you actually READ the Old Testament? And the only thing keeping you from justifiying all this rubbish is because "someone was nailed to a tree for saying how good it would be to be nice to each other for a change"(Douglas Adams interpretation)? Do you understand that sounds like a very tenuous basis to trust you have internalized adult ethics?
People didn't discover ethics at the Crucifiction. All the crap in the OT, ON BOTH SIDES, was instigated by the same ruling class bastards who are the spiritual ancestors of the ones we're fighting. Believe what you want--that is your right, but if you need the Crucifiction to make it clear much of that OT rubbish was EVIL(again, on BOTH sides) one has to wonder whether you have the moral courage to challenge authority and power effectively.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
I believe that man was the
I believe that man was the Son of God (God in the flesh).
Yes, I have read it. Not every word, but a lot of it and I studied it in school, church and Bible study.
"but if you need the Crucifiction to make it clear much of that OT rubbish was EVIL(again, on BOTH sides) one has to wonder whether you have the moral courage to challenge authority and power effectively."
No, I would not think it's right. I don't think what they did in the Old Testamnet was right, but that's all gone now and we don't have to follow those laws. The New Testament is about what it means to be a Christian. We are not ruled by those old laws.
I have all of the "moral courage to challenge authority" there is in the world and I still have room for more. I can't see anyone understanding that more than I do.
LOL
Thank you for proving my point so thoroughly Jason.
"we don't have to follow
"we don't have to follow those laws. "
They NEVER should have had to follow those laws. The only reason they did was the religous militaristic bastards of the time would kill you if you didn't.
And I'm not picking on the Hebrews. The Pharohs did this, so did the Romans(though they cared less about religous compliance, than civil obediance), so did anyone who was willing to kill to get and maintain power. This was NEVER okay. And all good people, of all creeds, in all times, knew it.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
"The problem is Jason's
"The problem is Jason's definition of a "Christian" is ludicrously narrow. Basically he's saying Fundamentalists are the ONLY Christians."
I can't say that anything other than that is wrong because obviously, I do not know that part for a fact. I hope that makes sense. I'm just saying that if a person doesn't believe the Bible is the Word of God, then that can make the definition of a Christian mean a lot of things.
The Bible teaches nothing but God's love and how to live a life that is based on that faith and love. If someone does not believe the Bible to be literal then what does a person believe exactly? Are they really Christians in God's eyes? I can't say they're not, but I believe that God could see otherwise based on what I've read and heard other people discuss, but obviously I don't know that for a fact. That's all I'm saying.
The Bible
is the most vile, hate filled, disgusting book ever written.
To claim all it "teaches is gods love" shows how far gone you really are.
I would suggest to seek therapy.
Just FYI it is impossible to be a true Christian in accordance with the bible.
To say that it is vile and
To say that it is vile and disgusting and that it teaches bad things shows that you have absoluetly no idea what you are talking about.
To suggest I need therapy and that every Christian is crazy, needs therapy and needs to be medicated is what sounds a little "crazy", if nothing else it's frightening how you think so badly about it. I can promise you that Chritianity is truly about faith and love and nothing else. Individuals are the ones who have used Christianity and the name of the Lord to "justify", in their minds, doing terrible things throughout history and things like that have happened in the name of many different things, including different religions and even various groups and organizations.
Also, just because someone is a Christian does not mean that they instantly become better people. We are still regular people like everyone else and people are flawed and weak. People do terrible things. Just because a "Christian" might do something bad, it does not mean it's because that's what they were taught to do.
It sounds like you have a some very deep problems with Christians.
You have said what you wanted to say on the subject. Why can't you two just drop it?
Actually I had--until you
Actually I had--until you tried to claim the Christian diversity "high ground" that was MY initial point(Christian diversity--not high ground). Wasn't going to let you slide on that one, chum.
Otherwise, yes, let's DO move on.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
Jason, Col. Sparks et al - I would be very interested to hear
your opinion/reaction to Vol. 2 of 9/11 and American Empire, especially Catherine Keller's chapter. I find her take on Christianity to be spot on (for me), especially regarding our deeper motivations for pursuing 9/11 Truth. Makes my soul smile. Yow!
I'm only about 1/3 through the book, but I highly recommend it.
I hope that you and yours are well.
The truth shall set us free. Love is the only way forward.
I'll drop what I want
when I want.
Yes I have problems with religious fanatics, fundamentalist nut jobs.
I have problems with people that are clearly insane but because of the moniker of religion they are protected from ridicule & the law.
How many times have we all seen some Fundy nut do something completely insane, whether its stoning their children to death or in the case of Hitler murdering 6 Million people and first thing you hear is oh "hes not a true Christian".
Bullshit, it is precisely "true Christians" that are the most insane and more likely to do something completely crazy.
This is the 21st century, as human beings we should be working to get past the pre dark ages mentality of religious dogma.
Belief in mythical sun gods, magic should not be prevalent in a civilized society in the 21st century.
There is no excuse in this day & age to believe such nonsense.
"“Good people will do good things, and bad people will do bad things. But for good people to do bad things that takes religion.” Stephen Weinberg
You have no idea what you
You have no idea what you are saying. You are taking this really personal, for some reason.
It is not "true Christians" who do the terrible things like the ones that you used as examples. You could not be further from the meaning of a true Christian. Those things are not taught by Jesus Christ or any true Christian. There is no violence, hate or cruelty in true Christianity. There is only love.
I know that many people have done terrible things in the name of Christianity throughout history, but those are the people that you speak of. They're probably not even .001 percent of all Christians. Every "group" of people have people who are mentally unstable who twist and distort things for their own agenda, but that does not mean that Christians and Christianity are the definitions of the things that you describe.
I don't believe in religion or mythical sun gods. I don't believe that people should practice magic of any kind.
You seem to not only "dislike" Christians. It seems that you hate them. One thing I can promise you is that this "hate" or whatever you call it, is a negative thing. I hope you can overcome these feelings and see Christianity for what it is...it's about believing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, giving your life to Him, accepting forgiveness, learning what it is to truly love and learning to let go and get rid of the sins that we were set free from. It's about learning to love, accept and forgive. How many people actually do this who call themselves Christians? Well, it seems like a small amount, sometimes, but anyone can call themselves anything. It doesn't mean anything until a person learns to live it.
Take care and God bless.
So much for dropping it
You don't believe in religon? What do you think Christianity is?
And you seem to be as uniformed about magic as you believe Nunaybiz is about Christianity. I say this as a Pagan/Wiccan---but note I NEVER put the practices of historical pagans before my own moral judgment. Most historical Pagans were good people; most historical Christians were good people.
I entirely agree with your point that in any group you will have a small percent who go bad--though .001 is probably too low. I'd say it's more like .01--say the same amount that owns most of the wealth currently? The problem--historically and currently--is that some of these people have so much power, they have a disportionate influence on the rest of the population. When people are manipulated by this group they can be capaple of anything--while believing they are a good person: burning witches, raping children, torturing "terrosits suspects".
While Nun. may be over-stating the case, the fact is political Christianity had been responsible for MOST of the bloodshed and wars in western european history. And its effects are still being felt across the globe. And major Christian organizations--the Vatican being the foremost--refuse to take responibility for past actions or even educate their followers about their history so lay people can be there to hold priests accountable when they screw up(I was raised Catholic). So you'll excuse us if we get a little techy if it sounds like someone wants to excuse this authoritarian BEHAVIOR.
I have a lovely neighbor who belongs to a Celtic Christian church who could tell you how this disfunctional rubbish from dualism infected early Christianity, but that's neither here nor there.
Believe what you want--as long as it inspires you to be a good person.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
LOL
Yeah like I said and you just confirmed, its never "true Christians" that ever do ANYTHING bad, EVER.
You can believe that all you wish, but every Christian claims and believes that they are true Christians.
Christianity has been responsible for most Wars Death, Civil Unrest, Racism, Sexism, Genocide than any other single factor in all of human history.
ANY and all religions that promote a single god, a god that demands obedience and tells its followers that all whom do not believe in me are going straight to hell.
A god that says unbelievers are basically the scum of the Earth and are to be distrusted or killed.
When "Christian Soldiers" get all hoped up on the lord and feel no matter what atrocity they commit is all perfectly justified by Biblical Scripture, then what you have is "good people doing bad things"...They are of course completely delusional, suffering from severe Cognitive Dissonance and Psychosis, they "believe" they are doing good, doing "gods work".
However in factual reality where the rest of us live they are as evil as human beings can possibly be.
"You seem to not only "dislike" Christians. It seems that you hate them"
Not quite, I absolutely HATE with ever fiber of my being "RELIGION" the "Institution of Christianity" etc.
I merely "Pity" Christians themselves for being so easily fooled by fairy tales.
I cant hate someone that has been brainwashed most of their lives to believe in this tripe.
Its not exactly their fault that they are simple minded or too trusting.
"it's about believing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, giving your life to Him, accepting forgiveness, learning what it is to truly love and learning to let go and get rid of the sins that we were set free from."
You see this right here is a completely psychotic statement of which not a single shred of empirical evidence exist to make one believe something so utterly absurd.
Number one there is not a shred of evidence any such person ever existed, Nothing, nil, Nada, zip.
Even if some shred of evidence were to ever come to light that a MAN by the name Jesus of Nazareth existed and even was crucified, the fairytale would end right right there as there is no possible evidence that could ever prove this man was a "son of any god".
So "giving your life" to a mythical sun god is crazy, it is based entirely on belief in a myth that real Archeology has debunked several different ways.
"accepting forgiveness" for what?
For being born a human being? LOL This is so absurd it is really hard for me to believe so many people so easily fall for something so incredibly bizarre.
Allow me to describe this psychosis.
Christianity makes a mockery of the concept of a God. At the same time that Christians claim to worship God as an omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent being, they make him out to be an incompetent bumbling idiot. Or worse. Simple forgiveness is beyond his capacities. God must "sacrifice himself to himself to change a rule he made himself!"
This is not only an absurdity, it is an essential absurdity. It is present in almost all forms of Christianity, and one can scarcely remove it and remain a Christian in anything but name. By definition, all Christians worship Christ - in some form - and most worship him as a savior.
But what, exactly, is he saving them from? Though it varies from church to church, no matter what they call it, it's God himself. A hell created by God, a world fallen as a result of God's negligence, a separation from God imposed...by God. How utterly absurd to worship a so called "Savior" of which what he is saving you from is "himself"! ROTFL
The NT that you keep on spewing from is without any question an "Astrological Drama" that was written in the old Pagan Passion Play style, most of this book was a series of Stage Plays based on Sun Worship.
The characters are allegorical and were never meant to be "historical".
Jesus = The Sun
Mary = Virgo
Joseph= Bootes
John the Baptist = Aquarius the water bearer
The 2 Fisherman = Pisces
and so on.
The whole story is clearly based on a 1 year "ministry" which is allegorical for a 1 year Sun Cycle, the 4 seasons.
I have read the Bible 4 times cover to cover, only on the 3rd time did it make a lick of sense to me once I learned the True Origins of the Bible, when I placed an Astrological Template over it then suddenly everything made sense.
I know, hell I have forgotten more than you know about the Bible. I have researched Christianity & various other religions for 32 years now.
In your state of delusion & Cognitive Dissonance you will of course flatly refuse to accept anything that goes against your "beliefs", that is a pity as there is really no way to have a rational discussion with someone that refuses to accept documented fact in favor of "faith" in something that the evidence proves is non-existent.
No I do not hate you, I pity you.
Here are a couple of
Videos and a book you should watch/read.
this ones about 6 mins.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7YTQUu-mGM&eurl=
this is a really good one from 1982, about 25 mins.
http://www.theocracywatch.org/av/video_life_and_liberty-256kbps.wmv
Here is a book you should read.
http://www.amazon.ca/American-Fascists-Christian-Right-America/dp/074328...
More information on what 'Good true Christians" are doing to this country.
http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/TheDespoilingOfAmerica.htm
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/7235393/the_crusaders/
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0505/S00149.htm
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0505/S00197.htm
http://www.yuricareport.com/index.html
http://www.emagazine.com/view/?757
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_lonna_go_060525_america_s_hitler...
Good & true Christians all.
Why does this site always
Why does this site always dump on Alex Jones?
He's the best truth warrior we got right now!!!
You guys don't like him because he actually GETS UPSET about what is going on and doesn't do so in a gentlemen-like fashion.
I don't think I'd be very gentlemen-like after I PREDICTED 9/11, told people to call the White House about it and no one did anything and people still think he's a nut case.
Alex - you're amazing, keep it up!!
GET MAD!!!
while Jones sells a lot of
while Jones sells a lot of products he has woken up countless people through his documentaries and website. your whole premise is ridiculous. Alex Jones does a LOT of good work along with selling a lot of stuff. i cant hate the man for wanting to make money as long as he keeps pushing important information. which he does correct? as far as just "fear-mongering" goes, i think thats even more ridiculous. comparing Alex Jones to Howard Stern? wow...........(and i acually dont mind Stern that much, he is what he is, but come on now.) i dont like the style of Alex Jones or Conner as much as i do other researchers and activists, but that doesnt make me blind to the postive things they contribute. the substance is there, even if the style is lacking. just fear mongering? maybe he shouldnt try and help expose 9/11 right? too scary? see my point? the good outweighs the bad, if people are dumb enough to think that Conner and Alex Jones represent ALL 9/11 truth activists then they are fucking morons who are better off staying ignorant anyway.
911oz wrote: "What has
911oz wrote:
"What has happened to the smart people on this website?"
So if people don't agree with you they aren't "smart"?
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
Wrong Assumption
People who have simplistic views about what is or is not a 'net gain' for the Truth movement strike me as less than smart.
Smart people generally are interested in looking deeper, and analyzing a bit more than the not-so-smart people.
The not-so-smart people think they are winning when they are being set up for a checkmate.
Editor - 911oz.com
"set up for a checkmate"?
You really believe this teevee show featuring John Conner is setting up a "checkmate"? Now that strikes me as "less than smart". Please elaborate. Because I want to learn more about how this teevee show will bring defeat to the 9/11 truth movement.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
Chess Analogy
Ok, I agree that 'checkmate' is too strong.
'Strategic advantage' would be a better term. They are always looking for ways to get a strategic advantage, and they have used a variety of disinfo gambits to achieve this, mainly by mixing 9/11 Truth with ideas which lack credibility, such as:
holocaust denial
apollo moon hoax theory
alien reptilian theory
no plane theory
space beam theory
pods
bible prophecy
The question of whether any of these might turn out to be true is irrelevant.
Editor - www.911oz.com
Over-reaction, much?
You haven't really paid attention to LeftRight's blogs or posts have you? Because if you had that little snarky "do something positive for the movement" etc, comment wouldn't have gotten typed on your keyboard.
BTW, since you bring up your old "friend", have you ever wondered about his relationship with SLC?
http://coljennysparks.blogspot.com/2007/02/strange-romance-between-screw...
A bit odd that, isn't it?
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
Just because he doesn't go
Just because he doesn't go about exposing the truth exactly how you would like it doesn't mean he's a shill or a fake.
He sounds very sincere during interviews and he's actually pretty damn smart.
No, he's not a geopolitical expert but he's got his facts down about 9/11 and he's trying to expose it.
I personally like his methods of confronting people - someone's gotta do it!!!
STOP HATING ON 9/11 TRUTH ACTIVISTS! WE ALL HAVE OUR OWN WAY OF SPREADING TRUTH.
GO OUT THERE AND START YOUR OWN WEBSITE AND BE EVEN BIGGER THAN CONNOR OR ALEX JONES!
Who's the Kook?
I would have thought the same thing a few years ago, but all it takes is a couple books and it becomes clear how the super bankers and the top of the controlled politicians and intelligence agencies are into some seriously skewed stuff. Whatever route you take to it, Bohemian Grove, John DeCamp's book "The Franklin Cover-Up," or even books like Nesta Webster's "Secret Societies and Subversive Movements" (published in 1924!), it becomes quite clear that they're not just psychos, but they're warped humans with a very diabolical plan - and luciferian belief, child sacrifice, and all kinds of sick stuff is without a doubt part of it.
The View has
millions of viewers, doesn't it?
yes,
Millions
"Imagination is sometimes more important then knowledge..."
Amazing
as usual - anyone who has a quicktime or Mpeg version of this - i would be eternally grateful.
when you juxtapose all of the celebrities and highly-regarded researchers who are now stepping forward (almost everyday now) - and compare it against all the gibberish coming out of the cointelpro crowd - the contrast is amazing.
it becomes obvious that the public is waking up - and that the disinformation campaign is getting increasingly arcane and ridiculous by comparison.
its amazing what a non-violent peaceful community can accomplish.
I really want to see your
I really want to see your film and hope it is released.
IT will be - i promise that
tonight i will be on Visibility 911 with Michael Woolsey from 911truth.org talking about disinformation and cointelpro. i will make sure to hit the holocaust deniers on your behalf.
Thanks!
Thanks!
QuickTime .mov format and same compressed for download
http://www.911podcasts.com/podcasts/TheView_ResistanceManifesto.mov
http://www.911podcasts.com/podcasts/TheView_ResistanceManifesto.zip
Peace
The View Hits a Homerun Again
First they plugged 911weknow.com and now this. Sweet.
No dude
9/11weknow is 9/11 Mysterties. NOT disinfo. Get real.
try this
search 'israel' or 'mossad''
what do you get? zero results
The View John Conner clip
ALOT happened in this minute of video...
- Rosie plugged '9/11 was an inside job' TWICE...That was awesome!
- Joy Behar (who supports the patriot movement apparently) showed great interest and started writing down John's website, just like when Brolin plugged 911weknow.com
- The Neo Con fake-blond to the right surprisingly said she would definitely check out John's website and/or youtube posts. She even told Joy Behar to write the website URL down for her.
- I thought the audience was fairly receptive and not immediately dismissive to this info, which is really nice for once. Although, the brief moment of laughter re-assured me that people are doomed to slavery unless they grow up and open their eyes.
- The folks over at Disney/ABC allowed this to go on national broadcast...
*Given this recent plug and others prior to this on this show, Lou Dobbs CNN opposition to the NWO's agenda, Keith Olbermann NBC anti-Neo Con stance , etc. etc.,
Could this mean that some of the Global Elitists are opposing the Neo-Con's and the people that pulled off 9/11? Could this add credibility to the notion that maybe the elite are fighting with eachother in a power struggle??
...just food for thought
The Global Elite is not homogenous
that is certain, they're only a bunch of individuals. However, even those that might now begin to oppose the aggressive neocon strategy do so not because they suddenly found their conscience, but because they've become aware that their foundation is shaking and they need to make amends. At least that's what I believe. All of these cynical powermongers intent on misleading and herding us like cattle should be stripped of their power, so that this will be the century of the people!
Totally
Totally, I agree....But there's a saying that says "Snakes always end up eating eachother in the end"...
I've also heard the term "Implode" being used when talking about the NWO and how it will ultimately destroy itself when it gets too big...
A Growing Crack in the NWO/Neo-Con Wall
"Could this mean that some of the Global Elitists are opposing the Neo-Con's and the people that pulled off 9/11? Could this add credibility to the notion that maybe the elite are fighting with eachother in a power struggle??"
Definitely. Don't forget about the recent Brzezinski warning about the possible (likely?) FALSE FLAG ATTACK (he used this laguage) to start a war with Iran. Brzezinski is clearly in league with the Global Elitists, but me thinks that there is disension within different factions. Some must see the writing on the wall, that the Neo-Con power grab in the middle east (triggered by 911) and promising to escalate into Iran, is a disaster for ALL (including many of the Power-Mongers who are happy to steal and cheat in more delicate ways). The dark forces are falling apart. Keep shining the light people.
Anticipation Kills
I can almost smell in the air another 9/11 or Pearl Harbor type event waiting to happen any week now...Dammit, I hope if anything happens it'll happen at sea and not home or another populated area.
Rosie A Closet Truther?
"Well, you have to look and make your own decisions."
Huh?
"So where is the oil going to come from?... The Middle East, with two-thirds of the world's oil and the lowest cost, is still where the prize ultimately lies."
Richard Cheney - Chief Executive Of Halliburton
It's great to see some
It's great to see some mention about 9/11 and inside job on a mainstream new source. We must never forget however, that the mainstream media has been vital in scaring the shit out of Americans with government propaganda. When the time comes for holding people accountable we absolutely must not forget the MSM. These giant companies need to be broken up. They need to be cleansed of psychological operations. I completely agree with those who think this antic is designed to get people to side against bush and the neocons when we must be wary of the other side of the isle also. Keep in mind that leading Democrats benefit from this war. Nancy Pelosi's husband is making an absolute killing. Stay focused on the big picture and don't let the elite minpulate us!
"... In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual." (Galileo Galilei, 1564 - 1642)
OIL IS OBSOLETE - WAKE UP - YOU'VE BEEN LIED TO, AGAIN!
http://www.waterfuelcell.org/
Pelosi's or Feinstein's?
Are you sure it's not Dianne Feinstein's husband your thinking of with respect to profiteering in Iraq?
If so, you wouldn't be the only one to get Pelosi and Feinstein mixed up.
Anyway, it should be clear that whatever fissures there are among the elites, none of them--neocon, neolib, whatever--wants the truth of 9/11 to come out. If the people get wise to how power really works, and how the powerful really think of them, then real, honest to god democracy will threaten to break out--and they'd be all finished, for their participation in this and all other scams up to this point.
That they are having to deal with 9/11 at all now is owing simply to the tenacity of this movement, aided by the internet. They would rather not have to deal with the issue at all, but they know how many of us now know, and they're not sure how to deal with it. Rosie's statements are a sign of progress--words spoken on network airwaves which certainly wouldn't have but for the existence and growth of this movement--but still, a certain wariness is in order in terms of what to expect next. Because, they would STILL rather not have to deal with us at all.
I Love It
this is great!!!!!! cant wait for more
Sign up for Digg already!
It takes like two seconds and we can get all 9/11 stories onto the front page with like 100 people!
Fighting for G.O.D. (Gold, Oil, and Drugs) is available now for pre-order on Amazon.
Yes to what operator kos said.
Sign up here:
http://digg.com/register
And then Digg the new "Digg it" link for this story here:
http://digg.com/celebrity/Rosie_O_Donnell_Says_9_11_Was_An_Inside_Job_on...
giddy too...
I am so proud of Rosie...what a fighter! Thank you for all that you are doing...keep fighting girl. For all of us that have felt the immense pain of finding the truth...keep the faith and be our voice!
This is F'ing Cool!
Who knew The View would be so cutting edge????
This is amazing coverage.
Right now all these housewives are looking at Connor's site. Right now questions are in many people's minds.
We now know that Rosie is at minimum open to 9/11 truth.
Yes Connor with his anti-gay views is not the ideal candidate to get the truth out but he's one of the few that's doing it, so we need to be thankful for him and his antics.
This is HUGE, props to John Connor and his resistance! Amazing that it's actually working but it obviously is!
Wow, I haven't signed on for
Wow, I haven't signed on for a day and a half or so, and I come back and things have blown wide open. Unbelievable!!!
New "Digg it" link for the Rosie 9/11 story...
http://digg.com/celebrity/Rosie_O_Donnell_Says_9_11_Was_An_Inside_Job_on...
I have sent praise to the
I have sent praise to the ABC feedback form for The View here: http://abc.go.com/site/contactus.html
Also, send praise to the hosts email addresses at The Views website here: http://abc.go.com/daytime/theview/
an opposing viewpoint ... from opposingdigits.com
Are women typically attracted to shallow stupid men like John Conner? How would Rosie have responded if she knew John's religious beliefs particularly towards homosexuals?
In the meantime: Alex Jones (GCN) is promoting the notion that Global Warming Skeptics are being compared to Holocaust Deniers. Does he expose the Lies about the Holocaust, or does he maintain his position as a Zionist white-washing traitor?
Don't whine to me that he talks about Zionism. He isn't naming names, he denies Israel's involvement in 911, and prefers to continually bitch about the Mexican border while Palestinians and Iraqis are tortured, raped, and killed.
ABC is also the one that reported on the Northwoods document which there's a lot of conflicting information on. Imagine if Rosie knew John's religious stance on homosexuality.
///////////////////// 911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
I don't understand how or
I don't understand how or why this comment is getting positive votes.
http://nizkor.org/
http://www.oilempire.us/holocaust-denial.html
http://www.remember.org/History.root.rev.html
look past the "holocaust" comment....
i only left it in because I do not excerpt or censor comments
/////////////////////
911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
I have trouble ignoring the
I have trouble ignoring the holocaust comment. Which part is the good part. I'll go take a look.
Rosie Deserves Thanks.
Too bad we couldn't get an email address for Rosie to make sure she feels a lot of support for breaking this topic out on mainstream television. The View. I looked but couldn't find no contact address to tell her thanks. Peace.
There might be hope for Rosie yet...
If Rosie wakes up to 9/11 truth, then it's just a matter of time till she puts 2 + 2 together and realizes she's completely nuts on the gun rights issue.
John Conner and Bible Prophecy
From reading his website, it appears to me that John Conner is a religious fanatic. I think that is a fair assessment, since he proudly states he uses Bible Prophecy as a research tool.
The following quotes from his home page are instructive:
“A large number of our political world leaders and corporate global elite are part of an intricate system of satanic secret societies. They believe Lucifer (Satan) set Man free in the Garden of Eden, and that the God of the Bible is the evil one.”
“Mormonism is a cult and the founder, Joseph Smith, was a Freemason. Mormons believe Jesus and Lucifer are brothers, and believe that they can become Gods, just like Satan said in the Garden of Eden.”
“Numerous sources including Ted Gunderson (ret. FBI), John Decamp (former US senator), Paul Bonacci (child abuse victim) and Rusty Nelson (Franklin Cover Up) report that Hunter S. Thompson produced snuff films in the Bohemian Grove in which people were murdered on film for entertainment.”
Notice the attack on Mormonism (I wonder what Steve Jones thinks about this). Notice the attack on Hunter S. Thompson (without any sources!).
If John Conner is not a paid disinfo agent then who needs ‘em!
Alex Jones seems to harbour similar views to John Conner. Perhaps he is partly motivated by the need to fill his news hour … or is there another agenda? He clearly has a strong interest in fanatical Christian thinking (cf. Texe Marrs, Michael Coffman) which is WORLDS APART from the progressive ideas of David Ray Griffin. The key difference is that the fanatics are appealing on a childish level to belief in simplistic notions of GOOD Vs EVIL and in the Bible as the Word of God.
In my opinion, being a Christian does not automatically require you to have these naïve and childish beliefs. Such beliefs are a wellspring of intolerance and are always used by those want to promote war. Such beliefs have no place in the 9/11 Truth Movement.
Michael Coffman’s website describes itself thus:
“Discerning the Times is a non-denominational ministry to the Christian Church and to all who desire to seek the truth about today's events as they relate to the Bible and biblical prophecy.”
On another page we read the following:
“While it is true that horrible deeds have been done in the name of Christianity by zealots who skewed the teachings of Christ, those deeds pale in comparison to the atrocities done in the name of Islam.”
www.discerningtoday.org
I can assure you of one thing: If people promoting literalist interpretations of the Bible become a dominant voice in the 9/11 movement, then that movement will never, ever have a mainstream acceptance because the global mainstream is secular in outlook.
Please don't interpret what I am saying as anti-Christian - what I'm criticising are the childish attitudes of literalist Christians - these people are not fit representatives for a global movement which must be based on universal values. These people are not interested in universal values. They have a view which is essentially similar to G.W. Bush when he says, "you're either with us or you're with the terrorists". This week they support 9/11 Truth. Next week they may want to outlaw homosexuality.
Editor - www.911oz.com
it was almost as if the lady (dunno her name) was saying...
at 4am, this is the crazy shit i look up on the internet... here's an example...
/////////////////////
911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
On the one hand, seeing Rosie O'Donnell
shouting "9/11 was an inside job" through her cupped hands was an image I will cherish.
On the other, let's be realistic. Who in their right mind would want John Conner's site to be the first thing someone just starting to explore 9/11 sees?
I still think it's a net win, but no one should underestimate the counterproductive aspects of Conner's site.
Yeah, ..."good news/bad news"...
...I'm a fan of (and amused by) Conner's 9/11 Bullhorn Activism, all the while realizing he's a problematic ally....due to some belief baggage that is alien to Joe NASCAR and Suzy Soccer-Mom...the people we need, to win...
And, I agree that The View's audience is not the best one for first exposure to 9/11 Truth being Conner's rants...this is complicated to assess whether it's a net gain or not....I still feel it more good than bad...
Brolin's View promotion of 911 Mysteries was much better messenger, message, and audience congruence for our purposes, though...
'Net Gain' is Not a Very Helpful Construct
The truth is you don't really know what the net effect will be.
But consider this:
What if this is a disinfo operation? What if John Conner was created and planted and seeded onto braoadcast TV deliberately by the pysop department of the CIA?
His website is designed to tar and feather the 9/11 Truth movement. They do this because in a pseudo-democracy it is not possible to completely censor all news - some info always leaks out . So, what they do is they attempt to discredit this info by associating it with crackpots and fanatics, and by creating divisions within the movement. I believe this is their actual strategy.
Your argument reminds me of a person playing chess against a player who offers you a high value piece and you think - 'hmm ... this is a net gain' when by taking the piece you are subject to an inevitable checkmate in three moves.
Do you still think it's a net gain?
Editor - 911oz.com
www.911oz.com
you have totally nailed
you have totally nailed it-----
good job
Trying not to rain on the parade versus tough love.
As a matter of fact, I re-wrote that post a couple of times trying to be as diplomatic as possible with folks who are obviously high on the possibility that this was really what it seemed. "Net gain" should probably be replaced with "eh, most people probably won't check the website, but maybe they'll remember Rosie propagating the "inside job" meme." I hope it was not as much of a net loss as you believe it may turn out to be, but you are quite possibly right. BTW, I suck at chess.
(I can envision a number of really horrific outcomes here. For one thing, if Rosie really doesn't know about his views on gays and finds out --that's inevitable, right?-- she could misdirect her anger at the Truth movement in general.)
yeah...it'll be positive in
yeah...it'll be positive in ways that the cfr didnt plan
but it was still started with negative intent
--------------------------------
but that makes it that much funner to screw them up!!
gettin closer and closer.....
this probably did set a good emotional tone with upper middle class women----
cause they wont check out the website----and they heard the words ---911 was an inside job
ha ha---screwed!
wake up from the nightmare ---american women!!
Tough Love Required Here!
In the beginning I thought John Conner was a well intentioned maverick, but his website is such a nightmare that I cannot see the publicity he is getting as anything even remotely positive for 9/11 Truth.
He looks like someone with training in acting or performance or something, he is fit, articulate and funny. I would not have picked him for the type of person to walk around quoting Bible Prophecy.
I know that fundamentalist Christianity is very popular in America. In Australia it is not so common and we are more skeptical and suspicious of people who hold these views.
Editor - 911oz.com
www.911oz.com
he's just a token
he's just a token shill----designed to be set up by the cfr (like in this clip)
and knocked down in a psyop later on by the cfr
pre internet thinking that already failed about 4 comments down on the 911blogger post
thats the heart of it
These posts are counterproductive and unhealthy
modes of of thought. For example, while Wagner was associated with the early Brownshirts he is mostly recognized as one of the greatest composers. His greater contribution eclipses the lesser.
The most compelling and truthful narratives will rise to the top.
Thats why many of us visit 911Blogger everyday rather than some of the less coherent sites.
As well, when we talk about an immensely important subject such as the truth of 9/11, John Conners views about homosexuality are irrelevant.
Anybody who turns out to be less than genuine will suffer similar annihilation as handed out to Fetzer, Wood and Reynolds.
Are you kidding me?
This kind of critique, amidst the excitement and enthusiasm, is one of the healthiest things that can happen. There are ideologies and theories whose association with 9/11 truth are extremely destructive. We can all agree on some of them -- such as anti-Semitically-motivated Holocaust "denial." There are others with which the Truth movement needs to wrestle, including various kinds of religious intolerance and bigotry.
misterguy, didnt you say you
misterguy, didnt you say you were gonna get off of this shit last week? remember? you said you were done turning this into a holocaust denial board. let. it. go.
Ditto. Impeachment.
Ditto.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
"Notice the attack on Hunter
"Notice the attack on Hunter S. Thompson (without any sources!)"
This has been documented. Just because he doesn't post links, doesn't mean that he is making this up. This information did not begin with John Conner. It began when Paul Bonacci, a victim of this sex/satanic ritual abuse/snuff ring, testified in court that a "Hunter Thompson" was involved.
http://www.tedgunderson.com/
I really hope that everyone has heard of the "Franklin coverup" and the CIA/government involvement in the child sex/kidnapping/satanic ritual abuse/snuff ring that is the main cause for the 250,000 missing/kidnapped children every year. If you haven't, take some time out to research it.
Hunter S Thompson and Snuff Films
I found this article. Excerpt below.
Apparently Bonnacci recalled that the name of a man who filmed the rape and murder of a young boy was Hunter Thompson.
I have a question - did he specifically identify Hunter S. THompson the writer, or did he merely say that the name of the mystery camera man was Hunter Thompson. This is an extremely important distinction don't you think?
---------------------------------------------------
Hunter and snuff films
The Gannon/Gosch connection was first made public early in the morning on Feb. 20. Later that same day, Hunter S. Thompson was found dead in his home, the victim of an apparent self-inflicted gunshot.
Few people would ever have thought to connect Thompson and Gosch, but those familiar with the tales of child abuse and pedophilia documented in "The Franklin Cover-Up," a book first released in 1994 by former Neb. State Sen. John DeCamp, understand the association.
In his book, DeCamp relates many interviews and discussions with Paul Bonacci, the young man who claims to have been involved with the kidnapping of Johnny Gosch. Bonacci told horrific tales of being forced into sex with adults and other children. In one case he recalls being flown into Nevada with another young boy whom he did not know. They took on another passenger there and headed to a secluded location where Bonacci says he was forced to have sex with the younger boy. The young boy, Bonacci claims in this book, was also forced to have sex with adult males, who then killed the boy with a gunshot to the head. Bonacci says he was then forced to have sex with the corpse.
The passenger they took on in Nevada filmed the entire thing, and Bonacci recalled that his name was Hunter Thompson.
"I think it's kind of strange that Hunter Thompson would commit suicide at this time," says Gunderson. "Several kids told us that he directed snuff films. I think it's a strong possibility that he was murdered and I strongly suspect that it's all connected."
And the speculation on the Internet has been that Thompson was either killed to prevent his coming forward, or that he killed himself because he feared his role as a director of child snuff films would be proven true.
-----------------------------------------
Editor - 911oz.com
"This is an extremely
"This is an extremely important distinction don't you think?"
Yes, I do. I thought of saying the same thing in my previous post.
Did he really ID Hunter Thompson
What I would like to know is if a witness positively identified the writer Hunter S. Thompson by either photo or line up.
I would say a positive photo ID would be a minimum criterion for taking the accusation seriously.
Editor - www.911oz.com
This stuff on Hunter Thompson
is way over the top and has no place here. Thompson is dead and therefore cannot be tried or convicted in any court of law for these outrageous accusations. This is irresponsible, pointless speculation and doesnt help the matter at hand.
What started it
Allegations re Hunter Thompson and what he may have filmed at Bohemian Grove were cited as one reason to denigrate John Conner and distance ourselves from him. That's how this thread got started.
There may be sound reasons (sounds like there are)to consider John Conner a loon, or even a disinfo agent, but I don't think including the topic of pedophile rings, the Franklin cover-up etc., on his website is one of them. I first learned about this stuff through Wayne Madsen, around the time that Jeff Gannon was exposed as a fake-journalist plant in the White House press corps, back in early 2005.
With that, I'll gladly leave this topic alone.
I don't think "Endorse" is the right word
http://m-w.com/dictionary/endorse
unless you consider it an ABC endorsement of GCN
:-)
/////////////////////
911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
To me it sounded like she endorses his work
And what are you talking about "an ABC endorsement of GCN"? As far as I know GCN pays ABC to use their satellite for their broadcasts. But I doubt this was any kind of plug for GCN. Are you being serious or joking?
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
you guys might be REALLY
you guys might be REALLY onto something...
with this gcn/abc connection
would not be surprised at all
gcn a fake controlled opposition network---secretly ran by abc???
possibly not also.....
but here's how you can tell that alex jones is shilling
he NEVER mentions the attempted bombing of the mexican parliament building in oct 2001-----by mossad with bombs
--------------------------------------
guess it doesnt matter at this point in the 911 movement ....
the genie is already out of the bottle
Have you ever tried calling his show to ask him about it?
He doesn't screen calls, so you should call in on Monday between 12-3pm est:
1-800 259 9231
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
Yep, Alex doesn't talk about
Yep, Alex doesn't talk about one issue and of course he's shilling.
It's so blatantly obvious that the man is a shill. I mean, how many people has he turned on to 9/11 Truth? Perhaps 90% of us? What a pathetic number. It should be 100%!
Alex Jones is a shill because he gets angry and doesn't expose EVERY OUNCE OF 9/11 NEWS EVERY DAY!
unlike all that dancing
unlike all that dancing israeli art fag bullshit...
the attempted bombing by mossad of the mexican natl parliament building in oct 2001----
directly implicates mossad
alex jones works for pro israeli interests----he can slightly criticize them---
but the mex parliament story is a big no no
----------------------------------------------------------------
to me ---that story is even bigger than wtc 7---
direct implication
9/11 — What Did the Israelis Know?
http://www.antiwar.com/blog/2007/02/09/911-what-did-the-israelis-know/
(no, I'm not in the blame Israel crowd)
Huh, even more found through antiwar.com
Cheering Movers and Art Student Spies: Was Israel Tracking the Hijackers Before the 9/11 Attacks?
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/02/08/1610254
If you watch this a couple of times...
...it seemed remarkably scripted.
Why? Who benefits? Did ABC let this happen or make it happen?
Did the blond who started the conversation (don't know her name) sneak it on with Rosie? Rosie appeared to know what was coming.
Did they sneak this past ABC or was it ABC's idea?
I still think all publicity is good publicity. And even though John's site may not be the perfect 9/11 truth site, it does have some eye opening links.
On a side note: I have it on good authority that a well respected NY Times reporter was personally handed a copy of 911 Mysteries this past Wednesday. The DVD was given to him by a close and respected acquaintenance who is an outspoken critic of the mainstream media and a 9/11 truther. If the Times breaks a story on it, you'll know where you heard about it first. If not, bummer.
Wow
Ken that's huge.
But how many established mainstream reporters have seen videos like 911 Mysteries and Loose Change and gone on to do nothing on reporting about them? Seems like it's probably happened a lot, throughout the country. Also, the NYT is owned and controlled by the CFR, and is where ALL mainstream newspapers get their top stories, so I'm doubtful that this reporter will do anything about the information he has.
That's exactly the same question I asked...
A quote from my friend's email regarding the Times reporter...
"We had lunch in the city on Wednesday and wouldn't you know it, the subject of 9/11 came up. Hmmm... He hadn't really heard all that much about it, and he knew that some of the early accusations had been debunked, and there really wasn't that much talk about it in the office. Wouldn't you also know it, I happened to have a DVD of 911 Mysteries with me! Now HE has it. If the Times breaks a story on this, you'll know where it came from."
Without revealing too much about my source, let me just say that this particular Times reporter recently wrote an article about the huge cost of the Iraq war. And that this particular Times reporter was once a student of the person who gave him the DVD. As such, the Times reporter already deeply respects my friend – in a big way.
This could play out one of two ways...
The reporter watches the movie, gets interested, watches more movies, researches on the net, proposes a piece to his editor and
a. Gets told to drop the story.
b. Runs with the story and the shit hits the fan
My friend will be following up in a few days and if I hear anything worth reporting I will.
Paul Krugman? Nick Kristof?
Paul Krugman? Nick Kristof?
If the history of mainstream media coverage is any guide...
then a.) would be the correct answer.
Sorry, but I'd be shocked if he tried to run with this and didn't lose his job. Remember the sad tale of Gary Webb and how his paper, the San Jose Mercury News, ultimately caved into the pressure, and pulled him from the story. And the New York Times was one of the vehicles most active in creating that pressure to stop revealing the truth about government ties to cocaine smugglers.
I had the great pleasure of hearing David Ray Griffin speak in New York back in the fall of 2005, and the only point in his presentation where my reaction was, 'Huh?', was when he called upon the New York Times to 'take the lead' in exposing the truth of 9/11. As the gentleman sitting next to me remarked, 'Don't hold your breath!'
Cough, choke...yeah, I give it about 25% chance if that
Cough, choke...yeah, I give it about 25% chance if that.
Believe me, I'm not holding my breath. I cancelled my Times subscription several months ago. They have lost their moral compass.
I gave the 'VIP" bundle to...
a local Dallas Reporter on Jan 27th. He aired a story on the miniscule protest here.
The "VIP Bundle" included 7 films on six DVD discs.
We must be the change we wish to see in the world. M Gandhi
Personally, I don't want anyone in this movement
who would be afraid of getting arrested if they spoke out about 9/11. We don't need that kind of cowardice within our ranks. So if this teevee show helps keep the cowards out who really cares? Not me.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
the cfr fuckers are trying
the cfr fuckers are trying to make it seem like someone should get arrested for questioning 911
there is no need for anyone to ever get arrested for 911truth
this is the most peaceful,respected,bravest activist group on the planet
-----------------this is a psyop that is trying to bring conflict to the innocent
god bless the constitution of the united states
if the 911truth movement wasnt making such a ruckus on the internet-----these rosie o donnell assholes wouldve taken over the world
things are really growing now!!
I don't think this was a psyop
To me it sounded like Rosie (and the other woman) respected 9/11 truth activism. I also think they did an overall positive thing for the 9/11 truth movement by discussing it. To me Rosie seems like a person who isn't afraid to speak her mind, so I really don't think she would allow herself to be compromised into helping a sinister group of people who are covering up 9/11.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
let's hope your optimism is accurate.
I remain cautiously skeptical ...
/////////////////////
911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
Me too, but
the interpretation I got from watching the video clip was that Rosie O'Donnell has probably looked into 9/11 before and doesn't believe the official story. She appeared genuinely offended when the young blonde laughed at the idea of 9/11 being an inside job. She made a defensive remark by telling the woman to look into it and make her own decision.
If this is some sort of set up, I don't think she's in on it.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
well you seem like a
well you seem like a positive person....
good for you
----911truth lets the old stagnation rot away
and gathers together the world to end
false flag terror
if youre feeling happy about this good for you
Thanks. Someone @ 911blogger has a sig line that reads...
"You can't stop 9/11 fever!"
I couldn't agree more.
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
that's jpass
I love that line - so true
The Eleventh Day of Every Month
Barbara
is CFR.... I really don't think that she is down with all this talk but there's nothing she can say to stop it without being fingered as CFR and revealing her affiliation. Rosie flicked her off when James Brolin said it the first time.
Notice this second time that Barbara was MIA.
___________________
Ignorance is NOT Bliss
MUST HAVE BEEN SCRIPTED
This exchange we saw on The VIEW sure appears to have been scripted...to appear to have been spontaneous.
GREAT JOB ROSIE!
We must be the change we wish to see in the world. M Gandhi
I agree...
It does appear that this whole dialogue was preplanned, the way they all jumped in on it.
Either that, or Rosie knows her truthers.
/////////////////////
911dvds@gmail.com - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info
WOW, John Conner must have
WOW, John Conner must have be having a pretty positive affect to get a mention from those ladies like that. He's just gone way up in my estimation, I must have underestimated him a bit.
Take that, fake-nazi moles and real-nazi vermin!
Check this out:
From Loose Change blog:
"Louder Than Words LLC will no longer be able to participate in the upcoming 9/11 Accountability Conference in Arizona on February 23rd - 25th, due to the involvement of Eric D. Williams who has authored a book promoting Holocaust denial, entitled "The Puzzle Of Auschwitz.""
http://loosechange911.blogspot.com/
And now from the Arizona conference site:
"As a result of the controversy surrounding Eric D. Williams, he has stepped down from involvement in the 9/11 Accountability Conference. The 911 Accountability Conference does not support Holocaust denial, nor does the 9/11 Truth Movement. No speaker listed here is known to have published works related to the Holocaust."
http://911accountability.org/accountability/index.php
Three cheers for Loose Change! I have new-found respect for you guys and much hope for the Final Cut.
9/11 Truth associations with Holocaust denial are suicidal for this movement. And the fake nazi moles know it. That's why they're here.
And guess what: I'm not Jewish. I'm a cathoic-born agnostic.
Ask questions. Seek truth. Most importantly, deny foregone conclusions!
jfal, what is your opinion of Real Truther, Kevin Barret
And posts like this......
"I'm posting this from Kevin's latest email for two reasons--it mentions his show tonight with the phone number at the end of the text, AND because I had attempted to post this as a blog but it disappeared in the ether. In any case it does touch on the subjects of 9/11, religion, and bigotry...
"Holocaust Myth" Libel Debunked
[This Friday on Truth Jihad Radio, 6-8 p.m. CT, http://republicbroadcasting.org, I will be discussing "bigotry, accusations of bigotry, and their role in interfaith dialogue and the 9/11 truth movement" with my guests Carol Brouillet and James Powell]
Last year, during a guest appearance on a Madison, Wisconsin talk radio show, the host compared 9/11 skeptics to "people who think the Holocaust is a myth." "Of course it's a myth," I responded, explaining that the word myth, in the academic sense, means: "Sacred narrative that is believed to be true, and that often inaugurates and legitimizes a social order or a way of understanding the world." Scholars are far more interested in the social and political effects of myths than whether or not they are true, I continued. Calling the Holocaust a myth, and exploring the destructive effects of that myth, as Norman Finkelstein does, says nothing about whether the story is true or false.
After a commercial break, the host came back with: "We're talking to Dr. Kevin Barrett, who says the Holocaust is a myth." That host was either an idiot or a liar, for he was confusing, whether deliberately or through sheer stupidity, the academic and popular senses of the word myth, only a few minutes after I had clearly explained the distinction.
Last week, a blog entry by Mark (gravy) Roberts from the blogs section at 911blogger.com, citing an out-of-context fragment of a private email, repeated the "Barrett calls Holocaust myth" libel. Of course it's a myth, Mark! That doesn't mean it isn't true. I have no doubt that among the 60 million people killed in World War II, a great many were Jews who were killed because they were Jews, Gypsies killed because they were Gypsies, homosexuals killed because they were homosexuals, communists killed because they were communists, Slavs killed because they were Slavs--and, perhaps worst of all, decent people killed because they were decent people who insisted on telling the truth in the face of a lying, war-criminal regime.
This does not mean that the Holocaust narrative is not a myth! In a scientific culture, one would expect the dominant myths to be empirically true--meaning backed by empirical evidence, not true in an absolute sense. Evolution, the big bang theory, the Holocaust, Pearl Harbor, the story of Muhammad's reception of the Qur'an, Genesis, the Gospels of Jesus, etc. are all examples of myths that are used by contemporary communities. Whether they are empirically true or not is irrelevant to their status as myths. I regularly use these examples in the classes I teach, and whenever the subject of mythography (the academic study of myths) comes up. Occasionally Muslims look askance at my characterization of their (our) sacred narrative as a myth, while others react badly to my characterization of the Holocaust as a myth -- even though I NEVER do so without explaining the term first! The moral: An educator's job is never done.
That said, I do think that Americans are going to have to get used to the fact that most of the world's Arabs and Muslims who have an opinion think the Jewish Holocaust body count has been exaggerated by Western historians, due to the natural tendency of the victor to rewrite history at the expense of the vanquished. The Arab world's leading statesman and political commentator, Mohammed Heikal, does not deny the Holocaust, but he claims that after conducting extensive research he believes that the true number of Jewish victims was less than one million. I suspect that very few of the world's 200 million Arabs or 1.5 billion Muslims would disagree with him. Personally, I have no idea who is right, the Western consensus or Heikal and other non-Western intellectuals and their Western supporters. I simply have not had the time or interest to do the research necessary to have an informed opinion on this question. If refusing to accept someone else's sacred story on faith makes me a heretic, I plead guilty. Given the ludicrous lies about 9/11 and other matters that have been perpetrated by Western academia, media, and governments, I think anyone who accepts anything these Western institutions say about anything, without personally verifying it through careful research, is a gullible person indeed.
The point of this fence-straddling is dialogue. As a person who has lived on various sides of various cultural fences, I see my interfaith-dialogue role as one of helping each side understand the other. This is not always easy. Arabs and Muslims generally regard pro-Zionists in almost exactly the same way that Jews and most Americans regard pro-Nazis or "Holocaust deniers"—as defenders of the indefensible who must be morally corrupt if not downright evil. I have spent countless hours talking to Arabs and Muslims trying to explain why Americans and especially American Jews think the way they do, and pointing out that pro-Zionists are not necessarily evil. Likewise I am sometimes compelled to explain to Americans why the Arab-Muslim world is essentially unanimous in questioning both the numbers and the meaning of the standard Western version of the Nazi Holocaust narrative, and trying to point out that 1.5 billion people may be wrong without being evil. This is often a thankless task. Extremists on one side call me a Holocaust denier while those on the other side call me a Jew-loving race traitor. (DB Smith actually called for me to be arrested as a Mossad agent because I am so friendly with Jews!) Interestingly, those extremists are virtually never Muslim—they're all white power types. Anti-Zionist Muslims are almost always polite and open to dialogue. It's just that nobody on this side of the fence wants to hear them–maybe because their argument about Palestine, and the irrelevance of the Holocaust story to it, is so compelling?
[Questions? Comments? Rotten tomatoes? Call in this Friday, 2/10/07, on Truth Jihad Radio, 6-8 p.m. CT, http://republicbroadcasting.org: (800) 313-9443]"
____
Should these guys be banned by DZ, jfal? What about it DZ, is it necessary to set a policy around these issues, real or hyped, and ban individuals and topics?
And jfal, please define and identify the exact individuals and ideas that are not acceptable to you and recommend some pragmatic solutions to deal the problems you identify.
Let me see, you think
Let me see, you think there's a problem with the site. Do you:
a--email the moderator(s) explaining your problem clearly and susinctly, knowing that the message will get to the person/people responsible and who have actual power to solve the alledged problem.
Or--
b--make a long winded, badly formatted, hard to read post, not even remotely on topic, or even on the same planet, knowing full well you are provoking drama?
Me, I always go for "a", but then I have a low drama tolerance. You're apparently a "b" kind of guy/gal. Hope that works out for you, sunbeam.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
ROFLMAO!!!!
Whatever--[insert mild Brit insult for obtuse foolish person].
Let's review reading comprehension: I did not give you an order. I was, however, showing you HOW what you're doing will not accomplish anything except--let's see, what's the word I'm looking for--Oh yeah! Hostility! Pointless, endless hostility! So I guess if that's what you want, carry on.
But, if it amuses you, by all means continue your passive/ agressive attempts to provoke me---into laughter.
Impeachment. Accountability. A better world.
Need help voting up 9/11 truth comments on Digg for this story
It's climbing up on the top pages. Digg it if you haven't yet:
http://digg.com/celebrity/Rosie_O_Donnell_Says_9_11_Was_An_Inside_Job_on...
And don't forget to vote the apologists comments DOWN!
_______________
"We are going to keep up this fight till the end, till the very end... They took it from the top to the bottom. We're gonna take it from the bottom to the top!" -Dan Wallace
JC
Yep, that crazy 'ole Jesus freak is Bad Ass Yo !
=)