Seargent Chavez lied.

http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/2006/09/centcom-stories.html
http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/2006/09/lauro-chavez-dd-214.html
http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/2006/09/newest-whistleblower.html

Proving once again that you will never get the ruth from a "truth" seeker.

with no evidence at all to disprove anything L Chavez says. And they invariably tack on a sentence to their attack which goes something
like this - if this is true, if he's for real, etc. THEN I will apologize, eat
my hat, whatever. To the people making these attacks against Lauro
based on nothing other than their disbelief that this is too good to be true - it would be the kinder, wiser course of action to post nothing, say nothing and let this man's story unfold. What purpose will it serve
for those in the movement to attack a man who is looking to be a hero to the movement and then offering your lame apologies later. This is a real person here. I am glad that I have never posted a
letter bashing an American hero with the stipulation that I'd apologize
later on when I'm proven wrong. If statements like this are somehow
considered contributions to the movement, think again. Verifications are being made. I suggest negative and foolish commentary cease in the meanwhile. Valerie

Look, we're all here because our common sense would no longer allow us to swallow unsubstantiated crap. There is nothing wrong with that. It's a good thing. I say what this guy says is crap until he really substantiates it. He didn't on alex today. I don't think a pdf of his discharge from the military as a sargeant will lead me to believe that he had any access at all to state secrets that might cause a revolution. I am not a sap for neocon bs, because I can smell it and know what it is. This too still smells funny, and when he makes the stink go away with some proof or substance, I will believe it. If you just accept stuff like this, people will find it easier every day to make truthers look like flakes and screwballs. Alex has to fill up hours every day, and he'll do it with bs if he has to. I don't think he should have this time, but I don't have his difficult job of filling three hours a day. This guy is just parroting things he reads off the internet back to us. It's silly.

You somehow believe that EVERYONE who questions what we were told about 9/11 all think the same, "deny 9/11 happened", or that we all think Bush flew fake planes into buildings. Why don't we just find common ground, as it is the so called debunkers who come out sounding like manic mean spirited assholes.

As for this story, I wasnt convinced at all listening to the Alex Jones show today...I have no doubt he was in the army or may have worked there, but Im not completely buying it.

Listen to this again and tell me that this guy doesn't go overboard trying to tell us what he thinks Truthers want to hear. He's way too slick (in sort of an obvious way).

I'm just asking....look at it from that perspective....

And, where are the verifiable specifics? What do you take away from it that is verifiable?

IMO, it's a hoax...let's not get played, folks...

Another 9/11 hit piece by Cockburn at Counterpunch.
http://www.counterpunch.org/cockburn09252006.html

Note two important items:
(1) Again, discussion of inconvenient facts is studiously avoided. He goes on and on about the Pentagon. I personally wrote to Counterpunch, urging them to take a serious look at the war games, but just as I thought, they are not mentioned at all.

(2) Cockburn's attempt to paint the 9/11 truth movement as a bunch of "nutcases" enlists the help of a very imprudent email he received. As you can see, screaming "F**K YOU" and going on and on like a rabid dog hurts our cause even more than Cockburn does.

So, you can see the standard debunker tactics at work here, and take action to counter them. Namely, (1) be polite, (2) be concise, (3) do not take the bait and get into arguments about the physical evidence. The 9/11 movement needs to stay ON MESSAGE: the war games, the money trail, oil/gas, drugs, Pakistani complicity, etc.

glad someone with a voice followed up on this; i doubt this will be the last time we hear from Chavez.

I cannot listen to Jones anymore, week after week he seems to go more over the top.

Chavez on the PowerHour in a few minutes.

http://www.thepowerhour.com/

The Week is a magazine that comes out weekly and pulls together all of the news stories around the world and the country. its a pretty good magazine. since it has more than just american media you get to see what other newspapers in other countries are saying. i got my copy yesterday and was infuriated at what i saw:

Assessing 9/11 Blame

9/22/2006

We may live in the Information Age, but there sure are a lot of misinformed people out there. In Indonesia, Turkey, Egypt, and Jordan—all countries said to inhabit the more enlightened quarters of the Muslim world—a majority of citizens still does not believe that Arabs perpetrated the 9/11 terror attacks, a recent Pew Research Center survey found. Many Muslims in the West cling to the same irrational view. According to Pew, 35 percent of German Muslims, 48 percent of French Muslims, and 56 percent of British Muslims answered “no” when asked, “Did Arabs carry out the 9/11 attacks?” Clearly, some debilitating social malady—a form of mass delusion—has afflicted Islamic societies.

But the same malady afflicts millions of Americans. A CNN poll finds that 43 percent of Americans still believe Saddam Hussein was “personally involved” in the Sept. 11 plot—even though President Bush has acknowledged that Iraq had “nothing” to do with 9/11. But if it wasn’t Saddam, who was it? More than a third of our fellow citizens suspect the federal government. In a new Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll, 36 percent called it “very likely” or “somewhat likely” that federal officials either participated in the attacks, or didn’t try to stop them “because they wanted the United States to go to war in the Middle East.” It’s alarming: There have always been zealots and conspiracy theorists at the fringes of society; human beings have an uncanny ability to filter out information they find troubling, confusing, or simply contrary to what they already believe. But thanks to the Internet, it’s now a snap to find a community of like-minded believers to reinforce your delusions. The nuts, it seems, are achieving critical mass.

Eric Effron
Managing editor
http://www.theweekmagazine.com/article.aspx?id=1659

i will now be cancelling my subscription. do me a favor and send the editors an e-mail and tell them how you feel.
http://www.theweekmagazine.com/feedback/index.aspx

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/september2006/260906deadcarcass.htm

-

The current media coverage of Bill Clinton's dispute over hunting Bin Laden, now Condi Rice saying GWB has not forgotten Osama, this is all such nonsense, because OBL is dead long already, that the only conclusion can be...like with Saddam in 2004...the neocons will serve OBL's death this time.
Just Imagine the media hype:
- DNA verified V!!
- Bush celebrated as the 'sheriff' who caught him "dead or alive" as promised V!
- Al-Qaeda announces a month of mourning, acknowledges GWB's victory....successor to be announced soon V!
- All throughout the election period on the news: terrorism experts debating if it's safe to declare victory yet in the W.O.T.
- meanwhile, completely forgotten in all this euphoria: omissions and distortions in the official account of what happened on 9/11....
- then: new Republican landslide victory !!

I am the one that broke the Lauro story on Veterans for 9/11 Truth.

Chavez: Yeah, I was deployed to Afghanistan for 8 months. About 2 weeks
after 9/11 happened. I was there in support of the United States SOCOM,
which if everybody has played the game SOCOM they are actually a real
entity, located all at MacDill Airforce Base, and I provide them with
communications, for the special ops teams. We flew into Kabul Airport, we
were actually under fire as we flew in.

War started on Oct 7, 2001 almost 4 weeks after 9/11.

I find it odd that Lauro was deployed in Afghanistan, and has no ribbon on
his DD 214.

Afghanistan Campaign Medal
http://www.gruntsmilitary.com/afghancamp.shtml
4. Criteria: a. Authorized to be awarded to soldiers who deploy to
Afghanistan in direct support of Operation Enduring Freedom (OEF) on or
after 24 October 2001 to a date to be determined or the cessation of OEF.
The area of eligibility encompasses all land area of the country of
Afghanistan and all air spaces above the land.

b. To be eligible for the award, a soldier must be assigned or attached to
a unit participating in OEF for 30 consecutive days or for 60
nonconsecutive days in Afghanistan or meet one of the following criteria:
1) Be engaged in actual combat against the enemy and under circumstances
involving grave danger of death or serious bodily injury from enemy
action, regardless, of time in the Afghanistan. 2) While participating in
OEF or on official duties, regardless of time, is killed or
wounded/injured requiring medical evacuation from Afghanistan. 3) While
participating as a regularly assigned air crew member flying sorties into,
out of, within, or over Afghanistan in direct support of OEF; each day
that one or more sorties are flown in accordance with the criteria shall
count as one day towards the 30 consecutive or 60 nonconsecutive day
requirement

Alfons v911t

I would just like to take this opportunity to thank the moderator who banned me for replying to being called a dis-info merchant, an agent and a spook, by calling the poster the stupidest fucking moron on the planet.

Thanx guys. Showing your true colours.

The first 2 stories that NORAD submitted to the 9/11 comission painted them in a worse light. Why would they lie to make themsevles look worse?

Why would a couple of military officers risk they careers to say they saw Atta only to be proved wrong by the official report (Able danger) Why was 1.5 TB of data then destroyed?

Why was the anthrax said to have some from US military and then that statement withdrawn? Why was the whitehouse on Cipro? Why would Islamists target sentators? More likely would be the administration.

Why was a dentist who informed the FBI about 3 hijackers poisoned? and his claims refuted. (Did he lie too?)

Why was the EPA whistleblower SWAT teamed?

Why does the USG not care in following up the Pakistan lead? Why would they then meet the same ISI and treat them with respect?

How was Building 7's collapse predicted? Were there any outward signs that it would collapse? You may say they building was damaged and on fire, but many other buildings were damaged and on fire (some were damaged far more severely) Why was the fire alarm switched off that very morning?

Also, you telling me that Mineta lied? If he didn't have an exact timeframe why would he specify one?

What's the likelihood of having 5 war game exercises occur on that very day, some imitating the actual attack?

Would you have admitted the possibility that the Bush admin had some prior knowlegde of the fact if it weren't for the PDB?

Would you have admitted that the JCS would sign off on a false flag against their people if it weren't for Northwoods?

Why did Bush show no reaction when told of the news. (Not even a casual question?) Why was he holding a book upside down? Why did he refuse to testify on the record for the 9/11 comission?

Why has the bin Laden tape not been confirmed by the CIA as to authenticity? Why is the picture quality so poor? Why does the FBI think he's left handed when the video shows him to be right handed? Why haven't the FBI officially charged him with 9/11? Why did the FOIA request for the facts surrounding the tape turn up nothing (I mean this is an important tape, are they that disorganized to not keep track of this info?) Why has he not been captured yet?

Atta: What of reports that he trained at a US mil base? Why did one FAA employee identify him as wearing a suit yet the pic (with no timestamp, and blurry, I could not make a positive Id) show him to not have a suit jacket on? Why was he going to take his last will and testament with him on the plane? What of his drinking, drug and lap-dance habits. Do you think he was really ready to die after all that?

LJ's Certificate of Release or Discharge From Active Duty

http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/LChavez_214.pdf

Sorry I cant log in - put to the back of the class for swearing at a jerk!!

You guys seen this?

http://www.halturnershow.com/MilitaryEyeWitnessSaysCheneyOrderedAirForce...

brianv

In the mainstream newspaper I get daily (just for local news, obviously) ran a cartoon ridiculing the 911 Truth movement--- but I got great pleasure out it since even bad publicity is good publicity. There is no such thing as bad publicity.
This means the 911 Truth Movement is SO HUGE that the mainstream newspaper CAN'T put it in the "memory hole" even if they would dearly love to. The fact is that so many people are talking about it and so many people are now skeptical of the mainstream media as a result. If the mainstream media completely igonored the 911 Truth movement it would be complete proof of their participation in the coverup of all Truth about 911, Israel, the war on Iraq, the neocons and so on...

Still don't trust this guy, if he's hanging with Franks then he mega high-level, something just doesn’t seem right about this to me at least. Also that shill "Amanda Reconwith" or whatever was pushing him, considering everything she/he pushes amounts to "no planes at the wtc" "Jews did it" and attacks and Dr Jones etc, there's something funny about him/her pushing "Chavez" also. The only whistleblower I need is Sibel Edmonds, at least she's got a gag order.

After reading LJ's letter when it first hit the internet the story appeared less than legit.
After listening to the interview there appears to be a better chance that it's legit. The vetting process has just started.

He repeated that he heard that a stand-down order was given.
He discusses the letter and his intent in writing it.
He didn't expect it to be printed in the paper....it wasn't.
It was a one-to-one correspondence to the paper's editor.
His letter to the editor was written in angry response to a piece in his local newspaper.
He didn't intend it to be on a par with a peer-reviewed scientific treatise.
He didn't intend for it to go public.
He was venting and wrote things hurriedly. In his frustration with the hit piece to which he was responding he threw statements in that should have been thought about more carefully. It was mostly his anger that got in the way of being entirely factual. He was basically just pissed off and ranting.
This is all very reasonable.

BUT, now that he's calmed down, he still says he knows a stand-down order was given.

I think there's more to come.
Alex suggested going over pictures to ID the colonel who said a stand-down order was given.

Now that he's in the public eye...
Others in the command bunker may come forward.
Others in a position to know from somewhere else may come forward.

As it stands until more comes out, what LJ has said can't be used with any authority....yet.

Treat the whole thing as a process rather than resorting to instant denouncement or instant endorsement. It has to be allowed to walk through the process.

There is certainly a large amount of factual evidence that entirely refutes the "official" story. If this LJ situation causes more people to understand the already vetted factual evidence, it's positive.
Anyone who already knows these facts isn't going to turn away from 9/11 truth just because the process of vetting LJ takes place.

The form that SGT Chavez posted is the DD214 Form 1, also known as the "short form". There are 7 parts of the 214, with each part going to a different agency (VA, Archives, etc). The "short forms" do not have the bottom portion of the 214 that includes the discharge information. The DD214 Form 4, aka "long form" will contain the information on his discharge.

I'd be interested to see the long form. A Chapter 13 discharge is not to attend school. A chapter 13 is "unsatisfactory performance". Basically a failure to meet military standards, but not doing anything so bad as to warrant a more severe action.

Without that official's signature the 214 is not an official document. So if SGT Alvarez reads this I highly recommend he contacts McDill AFB and try and have his 214 corrected.

Mr. Lauro is a lying stinking cocksucker. He cannot say he was sent to Afghanistan "2 weeks after 9/11" when we know that the war did not start until October - FOUR WEEKS after 9/11.

Another liar for that so-called "911 Truth Movement." That's not truth - that's BULL SHIT.

We should form a group just to spend time showing all the lies of the "911 Truth Movement."

sounds like this guy might end up loosing his job. =( a very high paying job for ohio....

I'm counting on you L.J. We all are.

"A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves" – Edward R. Murrow

Sometimes I like to think what it would be like using a fictional situation.

What if next week the MSM headlines read:

"Ten at 911 Military Command Center Say Cheney Gave Stand Down Order"

This Guy Is Getting Hilarious

SGT Chavez's hole gets deeper:

Q - How soon after 9/11 did you go to Afghanistan?

It was about 2 ½ weeks after 9/11 that it happened, the 26th, a couple of weeks, few weeks.

That is interesting, because in his original letter he said the 25th. Must be a time zone thing...

Q - Now that you know what you know and you were sent to Afghanistan... Did you still think in your mind that you were trying to get the Taliban, Al Qaeda, or Bin Laden?

That’s the thing. I flew into Kabul Airport, like, I mean literally when our C5 came in, we were escorted by jet. We were escorted by F15s and we were getting shot at, like, they were literally, like, pop-shotting up at the planes as we were trying to land because the Special Forces and the Air force para-rescue guys had just, had just cleared it, like, literally like, we were there like, I was there, like, five hours after like, the fire fight where they actually got everybody, like all the Taliban moved back out of the airport so that we could land planes, ya know. So, like, I’m on a, we’re on a big C5 and we’ve got all our vehicles underneath us, and I’m mean, I’m just like, “Oh God, ya know, this thing could fall out of the sky, because it doesn’t ...”

This part is just hilarious. For starters C5s were hardly used at all during the beginning of the war, the airports were not long enough or in good enough shape to handle that large of a plane, the C-130 and C-17 were used instead. Secondly, how did we manage to take over the entire airfield, without anyone other than Mr. Chavez, not even the Taliban apparently, noticing for almost 2 months?

He continues:

I don’t know if you’ve ever seen a C-5 fly, but it looks like it’s not even moving, it’s so big. So it’s really easy to like shoot at, like a machine gun, ya know, and ya know, like, there were bullet holes on the sides of the plane. And of course they didn’t come all the way through, but and we’re all looking at them later and I’m like, “Holy cow, we’re getting shot at!”

Wow, now we have bulletproof C-5s! What will they think of next?

But, yeah, I thought we were going to Afghanistan to hunt down Bin Laden. I’m helping in the search to hunt down Bin Laden. No. Not the case. Actually, I actually was providing communications for special ops guys and then I was pulling roving guard, guarding the pipeline.

Q - Guarding the pipeline for oil for United States... corporate, right?

That’s right. A lot of people don’t know about the pipeline. A lot of people, when I talk about that are like, “What are you talking about?” And I’m like, “Dude, there’s a huge... like, the Alaskan pipeline, that comes all the way through Afghanistan, like down in the Gulf, it comes through Pakistan...” I don’t know where all it goes, honestly I haven’t really found a whole lot on it, but... I was, I had to pull shifts, like every two or three days they’d..... I’ve have to pull a six hour rotation, on top of a humvica(?) driving around pieces, these sections of this pipeline to make sure that, ya know, like, guys weren’t going to come blow it up. And ya know, then, that’s when I started thinking, I’m like, I’m like, well, “What am I here for man? I’m not protecting people, I’m protecting oil!” Ya know, who wants to get shot for that? They give you guys awards, ya know, and I’m just like, “For what? Ya know, what did we do? We protected someone’s money. Ya know, somebody’s investment.”

Yeah, a lot of people don't know about the pipeline, like, for example, the government of Afghanistan!

“The agreement was signed in the expectation that the security situation would change in the next two years,” said political analyst Qasim Akhgar. “It certainly will, but it is not clear whether it will get better or worse.”

The pipeline proposal has been on the table for decades. The first tentative agreement was brokered in 1984, but fell apart because of the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan. Another plan in the early 1990s was scrapped because of the factional wars that followed the Soviet withdrawal.