"9/11 Eyewitness" is Probably Disinformation
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3211807290597119388&hl=en
"Blue Star Media Group" and Rick Siegel are suspect. Look at the speculative, misleading crap in the above trailer for "WMD at the WTC." The film actually claims that "directed energy hydrogen fusion" or thermonuclear devices were used to bring down the towers.
While their production quality and promotion is surprisingly strong (well funded) they seem to make up most of their "evidence" out of thin air.
The original "9/11 Eyewitness" arrived on the scene last year out of nowhere with a slick promotional burst and wide distribution. The "new evidence" in the movie seemed to be stretching it (to say the least) and the myopic focus on controlled demolition was quite suspicious.
Rick Siegel and friends appear to maintain the following slick websites:
http://www.911eyewitness.com/
http://www.striketheroot.org/
http://www.ricksiegel.com/
http://www.911citizenscourt.com/
http://www.onlinetv.us/index.php
http://www.onlinetv.com
http://www.911eyewitnesstruth.com/
None of these sites seem to link to credible 9/11 research and they all appear to be template module sites meant to look professional, respectable, and active. They mostly only link to each other and repeat the same content.
Rick Siegel is also the main promoter behind the (diversion) DC event, featuring such renowned speakers as,
Bob Bowman
James Brewster
Dennis Morrisseau
Brian O'Leary
Alfons Olszewski
Morgan Reynolds
David Shaw
Richard Siegel
(Somebody tell Bob Bowman he's been hoodwinked!)
Hey Truthers. Get with it! Calling out the bullshit is not divisive, it's what makes us a Truth Movement in the first place.
More qeustions about Rick Siegel:
http://control-alt-delete.ca/v-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=6005
http://911research.wtc7.net/re911/adhominem.html
http://www.911review.com/reviews/911eyewitness/index.html
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I totally agree, I’ve
I totally agree, I’ve always thought 911eyewitness was a bit weird. The voice over is so abrasive, and it’s got like elevator music lol. I found it very detached from the seriousness of the subject, and couldn’t recommend it to anyone.
**IF** he is disinfo
isn't the fact that he was across the river filming the towers raise some eyebrows?
I remember seeing his WTC1 and WTC2 security badges in the first version, so there is some connection with the Towers months before 9/11 and Rick Siegel.
not sure but
in the film he said he woke up after the first tower was hit, jumped in the shower and got to the pier after wtc2 was hit and proceeded to set up his equipment.
and if he lived in NJ wouldn't tmake sense that he was across the river?
also, the WTC badges have years on them from the 90's so not sure about the whole "months before 9-11" argument. You can clearly see in the photos compared to the film that the pictures were old, as he was younger looking in them.
but with the nuke crap in his new film, he clearly has jumped the shark. (although i have only seen the trailor if his new one)
his analysis of wtc7 is pretty darn good and his explanation of pyroclatic flows is spot on. you can't have pyroclastic flows without hot gas and dust. the question is, where did the hot gas come from? Controlled demolition provides it.
yeah
this movie really did seem to appear out of nowhere. i don't know anyone in the movement who was/is associated with Rick Siegel.
International Truth Movement
http://www.truthmove.org
Who would associate with a
Who would associate with a nobody? No respectable organization mentions him. How come he put that video up on his onlinetv.com site that day? Who told him to be there in Hoboken? Who did he know? Who is he? How come no one knows anything about his background? Why do organizations ignore his conference? They know something. How come he has those slick sites? Who is funding all that? They had to have cost a lot of money to create all those slick sites. Who is the designer? Who hosts them? They are filled with exotic symbolisim, very scary some of it.
It's good to see no one is fooled. His sites brag that he has a whole 60 dollars in donations so it is not coming from the people. I guess no one is fooled by his call to "restore the republic".
Thank goodness we are not breaking with the program! On to GZ!
you got it!
my sentiments exactly!
International Truth Movement
http://www.truthmove.org
But what about its value as
But what about its value as a video that captures the pre-collapse explosions? Can't we simply take part of the film and use it for our own purposes?
I agree with the other criticisms, but Siegel seems more likely to be just an oddball rather than a disinfo agent. He strikes me as a disaffected hippie, and maybe someone who has spent too many hours with computers.
i don't think the CIA or other disinformation agents are....
..that stupid. whether rick siegel "resembles" an agent doesn't mean much to me. i think the CIA could find/create any sort of character they desired. i can just picture them saying, "hey rick, throw on these kooky sunglasses and act sort of weird--that'll convince everyone that you're not an agent."
International Truth Movement
http://www.truthmove.org
there is no more disinfo in
there is no more disinfo in Eyewitness than there is in Loosechange
Certainly for the first
Certainly for the first loose change, "the pod" and all that shit etc. But the second edition's faults are largely speculative, and the affect it's had is a positive one. The new 911eyewitness on the other hand is apparently going to talk about WMD's bringing down the towers. That's as wild as “no planes” and “pod”s combined, if not more so. Especially when there's a ton of other highly credible points to make. So I say f*ck 911eyewitness lol! And f*ck DC go to GZ on 9/11!
it must be centered on reynolds new paper
the "EMP" theory?
I read through his paper, but the angle he takes on it broadly attacking jones is not very palletable.
"The new 911eyewitness on
"The new 911eyewitness on the other hand is apparently going to talk about WMD's bringing down the towers. That's as wild as “no planes” and “pod”s combined, if not more so."
well to be fair, the 2nd edition of Loose Change is filled with equally ridiculous speculation (although i agree a nuke at the WTC is just laughably kooky)
The movie promotes a definite "no plane" theory about Shanksville and the Pentagon. Even though they do not outright say it, their implication is that something other than a passenger jet plane was at both locations.
Also the emergency bomb threat landing of the mystery flight (relating to flight 93) is so filled with logical holes that i honestly dont even know what point they were trying to make with that part.
oterhwise i agree with you that the overall positive impact of Loose Change is amazing, Eyewitness does have some really interesting parts if you sift through it enough.
The clip where they show the ball being dropped side by side of WTC7 is very well-done imo.
let me make a clarification,
let me make a clarification, I think 911 Eyewitness comes dangerously close to being another "painful deceptions" or "911 in plane site". I love loose change. I've probably seen it over 50 times. I am very excited for the 3rd installment. But you cannot ignore some of the blatant "no-plane" stuff being implied in Loose Change.
im curious when most people
im curious when most people here say something is "disinfo" what definition are they usually using? the 1st or 2nd of the below? I see a lot of stuff that would fall into definition 2, but nothing so striking that i would say for sure is definition 1
dis·in·for·ma·tion (ds-nfr-mshn)
1. Deliberately misleading information announced publicly or leaked by a government or especially by an intelligence agency in order to influence public opinion or the government in another nation: “He would be the unconscious channel for a piece of disinformation aimed at another country's intelligence service” (Ken Follett).
2. Dissemination of such misleading information.
whoops i meant to put this
whoops
i meant to put this definiton..........
n : misinformation that is deliberately disseminated in order to influence or confuse rivals (foreign enemies or business competitors etc.)
as #2.
disinfo
while rick siegel and others may firmly believe that thermonuclear devices fired from helicopters (or whatever) felled the towers, that doesn't explain the slick production, promotion and web sites behind this particular team. the important questions are: who is blue star media group? who put the money up for the movie? who wrote the script? and why are these fringe theories being disproportionately represented through these media while no one in the mainstream 9/11 truth movement has ever touched them?
International Truth Movement
http://www.truthmove.org
Disinformation
The obvious way to deflect all disinformation is to always,always,always go back to the fact that the WTC buildings could not come down in free fall time without explosives. Any contrary claim defies gravity and the laws of physics. There MUST be a REAL investigation, nothing else can determine what really happened.
"n : misinformation that is
"n : misinformation that is deliberately disseminated in order to influence or confuse rivals (foreign enemies or business competitors etc.)'
No planes at the WTC would definitely fall into this category. The rest are probably just honest mistakes. The no-planers at WTC are without a doubt disinfo, but the term gets thrown around way too much in other areas.
maybe rick siegel is totally authentic
but what about his production company "Blue Star Media Group?" and the production certainly seems to quite complex and well promoted. in fact, rick siegel only plays a tiny role in the movie, it is the scary-sounding hollywood narrator who does most of the talking. did rick siegel write the script? did rick siegel do al the fancy graphics?
i'm not calling everyone disinfo. i'm bringing up legitimate questions. it is only weak-minded followers and those who seek to deceive and dominate who discourage people from asking legitimate questions. which are you?
International Truth Movement
http://www.truthmove.org
"i'm not calling everyone
"i'm not calling everyone disinfo. i'm bringing up legitimate questions. it is only weak-minded followers and those who seek to deceive and dominate who discourage people from asking legitimate questions. which are you?"
I think it's the other way around. I'm very suspicious of people who run around calling everyone "disinfo". Why not just challenge This guy on the evidence instead labeling him a shill? It's THIS kind of stuff that divides and discourages people. With the no-plane stuff I think there's a legitimate case to be made that it's disinfo, but most of the "disinfo" claims I've seen are just soap-opera theatrics.
DC in September
As a founding Auxiliary Member of the Veterans for 9/11 Truth, I would like to tell you briefly what we are doing. Our group was denied the right to rent a table at Camp Democracy because they said that they will not allow "conspiracy" groups to rent a booth(see www.V911T.org for more info).
So, dozens of us will be going to the National Mall in DC from 9/5 to 9/21 and simply walking around and talking about 9/11 as an inside job to those visiting from the peace & social justice movement.
Without as much as a table or even a place to hang a banner, we will be walking around and doing old-fashioned grassroots one-on-one activism day after day after day. We will be carrying 9/11 fliers and free DVDs to hand out in our backpacks.
No, we certainly do not wish to distract anyone from going to GZ! Of course you may do that and hopefully many will be there in NYC to join you! The site of WTC is an important historical event and our reaching the "peace" activists in DC will not take away from the importance of GZ one bit.
Many people, such as one of the co-founders of the V911T group and others, will be going to *both* NY and DC in Sept. because Camp Democracy in DC runs all the way from from 9/5 to 9/21.
We hope you can all come down to DC for at least a couple of the days and just mingle in the crowds with us on the National Mall in DC and help us wake up hundreds of thousands of anti-war visitors coming to DC from all around the country.
A small note on Rick Siegel: I have been also studying Rick Siegel's efforts and want to caution others not to make the same mistakes I have made in the past and jump to conclusions quickly and publicly. I am admittedly not a scientist and can not tell you (yet) which explosive techniques were used so for now, I am reserving comment, as I continue to study this.
Also, know that there actually are people skilled in computer design and who have connections to wealthy benefactors who sometimes even wish to remain anonymous... so because someone has money and a video company does not necessarily make them an agent on the payroll. Again, this is coming from 3 years of experience as a person who used to jump to conclusions and pre-judged others far too quickly. The more one does this, the more one realizes that everything is not always as it seems. We live and learn and sometimes I have found that those who seem the most harmless, congenial and benign - actually are not.
Hope to see you in DC if you can make it. We have a huge job down there to do and only a couple of 9/11 groups have announced that they will be sending folks down to "work the crowds"... so we can certainly use all the boots on the ground we can get either before or after your trip to GZ.
Thanks so very much,
Cathy Garger
Auxiliary Member, Veterans for 9/11 Truth
Associate Member, Scholars for 9/11 Truth
to each his own
the evidence against Siegel speaks for itself. Hoffman's piece is just one of many indictments against him.
International Truth Movement
http://www.truthmove.org
Do you contend that Siegel's
Do you contend that Siegel's focus on "thermonuclear" wmd's and helicopters deserves as much respect as say the evidence presented in "Improbable Collapse?" Perhaps you should ask Mike Berger what he thinks of "9/11 Eyewitness." I'd wager that he agrees with me.
Bombs may well have gone off in the basement. The marble panels and damage to the lobby do seem to suggest something like that. That doesn't justify Siegel's other wild theories.
Yeah, I'm disinfo because I don't say that FOR SURE THE TOWERS WERE BROUGHT DOWN BY THERMONUCLEAR HYDROGEN FUSION WHATEVER THE FUCK.
Your thinking is of very poor quality.
International Truth Movement
http://www.truthmove.org
911Eyewitness
Delver seems to be trashing Rick and 911Eyewitness in an effort to promote Improbable Collapse that claims to be the first program to use science. Talk about misleading propaganda. Seven Laws of Science have been out for a year in 911Eyewitness and Improbable Collapse makes this kind of boast.
Hoffman trashes everyone from Alex Jones to LC and In Plane Site. If he's not an agent he's giving them a paid vacation. He supports the official story of a big jet at the Pentagon and the Seismic signals are not from undergound explosions but debris hitting the ground. Is he hoping for a medal from Bush?
So are we supposed to trust his opinion on anything else he comments on? His vast honey pot websites are likely designed to track everyone's IP numbers and see what info is gaining the most attention.
It's the CIA's Mockingbird Op mandate to infiltrate all forms of media so which 911 info sites are tainted?
280 first responders with rare cancers four years after 9.11 doesn't justify considering fusion?
Perhaps many folks are not aware of the difference between fission and fusion or that directed energy weapons designed by the military for demolitions are declassified.
100 days to cool down the debris piles when the collapse put out the small isolated fires that firemen reported by radio. Likely the cause of pushing the demo button ahead of schedule.
As 911eyewitness points out, the evil doers had to move up the time table because if the fires were put out there would be no reason for the towers to fall.
The flashing helicopter as part of Rick's reverse angle seems to have sparked an unusual amount of attention considering the 2 hours of evidence and analysis presented. Is there something to it?
Trying to get people to notice that all those helicopters didn't even try to rescue anyone but were possibly signaling each other prior to the collapse seems to have upset some folks.
A DVD that tries to inform the public about 911 with actual footage and science analysis gets trashed without recognizing the numerous merits and accepting the low budget production limitations.
Who is really behind these vicious attacks against footage that could be used in a court of law?
Credible
The only fully credible movie about 911 is 911: Press for Truth. All others speculate beyond physical evidence. They all sound plausible, but the fact is without a full investigation nothing is provable. I'm sure a nice convincing film could be made of Judy Wood's Star War beam theory too. 911 Truther's need to stay focused on getting a new investigation - which will lead to access to evidence - which will lead to a fuller truth.
PARANOID!!
YOU FOLKS ARE PARANOID BEYOND BELIEF WITH YOUR PRECONCIEVED NOTIONS.
Time to break out some Black Sabbath.
Gary
911truthnc.org
“it is possible to fool all the people all the time—when government and press cooperate.” George Seldes - "legendary investigative reporter"
The scientific sound analysis is the real deal.
"9/11 Eyewitness" has what I believe to be a smoking gun. It is the scientific sound analysis on the explosions before and during the collapse of WTC1. So far I have not been able to find one credible review that discredits this analysis, not one, and I have looked hard for one. I have found some that have tried, but the reviews were baseless and seemed to be just the work of shills for the government. They had no substance or evidence that proved or inferred the sound analysis to be fraudulent. Also, any time I ask a shill on a forum to comment on this analysis, they just won't do it.
Not one word out of them. This is further proof it's a smoking gun.
I will have nothing to do with the "no-plane" garbage, and as far as nuclear, I haven't found anything credible yet, but I am still looking as I am not fully convinced. Perhaps a 4th generation nuclear weapon was developed (under the "radar") sometime before 9/11, one that we do not know about...yet.
But apart from everything, I repeat, "9/11 Eyewitness" is great for the scientific sound analysis it has. (It and WTC7 are what first convinced me 9/11 was an inside job.)
I can see why some would crtiticise Rick Siegel for certain things, but please cut him some slack. How many of you are responsible for finding a real 9/11 smoking gun about the truth of 9/11, one that is powerful and convincing of controlled demolitions being done at the WTC?
Besides, we shouldn't be critical of the 9/11 smoking guns that exist, as there aren't that many. There is a lot of excellent peripheral, secondary evidence regarding 9/11 truth, but not many smoking guns. We should be thankful for the ones we have.
smoking gun!?
sound on a videotape that was recorded and edited by people you don't know is not a smoking gun.
International Truth Movement
http://www.truthmove.org